openinverter forum

Gregski wrote: ↑Wed Nov 03, 2021 10:53 pm this is the Inverter harness, officially called Engine Room Main Wire part numbers:

82111-30K62 fits 2008-2009
costs $7,144 new
​
82111-30K64 fits 2010​
costs $6,341 new


IMG_5958.JPG

The Resolver plugs from the transmission harness plug in directly into the Inverter harness like so

IMG_5917 labeled.jpg

if you can prevent the seller from just cutting off the pig tail and get them to unwrap about 18" away from the Inverter plug then the Resolver plugs come with the Inverter plug like so

IMG_5976.JPG

the full anatomy of this harness can be viewed here: 1971 GMCe Lexus GS450H BMW 530e Tesla Model S powered Electruck

Brilliant work! Here's one on eBay for ~$200. Someone needs to snatch this up! https://www.ebay.com/itm/194128890766?h ... Sw2nBgnrrX

PatrcioEV-ATX wrote: ↑Thu Nov 04, 2021 7:42 pm Brilliant work! Here's one on eBay for ~$200. Someone needs to snatch this up! https://www.ebay.com/itm/194128890766?h ... Sw2nBgnrrX

Awesome find! Gosh darn it, this is in my town, and I messaged them on eBay and asked for this harness and they replied they did not have it, goes to show how the sellers still don't know electric / hybrid cars.

Note the third part number for this harness on this eBay listing

82111-30K71

this is probably why they did not offer it to me cause it did not exactly precisely match my VIN

Just a friendly reminder for those who is about to use standard GS450h HV cables as they is. They tend to wear under interference screen caps. In some period of time a short circuit might occur. Don't know if this issue was already exposed, so warning just in case

konstantin8818 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 03, 2021 1:08 pm I've fabricated that locking ring for high range, I've shared here before, from solid piece of aluminum.
It fits like a glove.

Fantastic work on locking ring.
How are you progressing on coupling MG1 and MG2 together. Are you planning to come up with something other than welding?

arturk wrote: ↑Sat Nov 06, 2021 11:28 pm Fantastic work on locking ring.
How are you progressing on coupling MG1 and MG2 together. Are you planning to come up with something other than welding?

Thank you!
Helical gears are not so easy to measure, to create some sort of locking brackets. Also carrier case is welded, so to install brackets between satellites, you need to remove them first. It is complex process. I think at first I need to make sure this whole power split device locking method is worth it.

konstantin8818 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 07, 2021 8:47 am

arturk wrote: ↑Sat Nov 06, 2021 11:28 pm Fantastic work on locking ring.
How are you progressing on coupling MG1 and MG2 together. Are you planning to come up with something other than welding?

Thank you!
Helical gears are not so easy to measure, to create some sort of locking brackets. Also carrier case is welded, so to install brackets between satellites, you need to remove them first. It is complex process. I think at first I need to make sure this whole power split device locking method is worth it.

I agree, creating locking mechanism could be complicated.
I would love to eliminate/lock power split to reduce need for electric pump (or eliminate it completely) but also eliminate play between all those unnecessary gears in power split and input shaft splines. I got input shaft locked using OEM spline. After driving car for a while i find there is enough play to cause unpleasant clanking noise when switching directions (R>D>R...) and changing between acceleration and deceleration. Also, during take-off (under 20mph) there is little bit of gear whine coming from power split planetary gear set. All that is not terrible and I guess some could get used to it but I am pretty determined to eliminate it or reduce as much as possible.

arturk wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 11:06 pm

konstantin8818 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 07, 2021 8:47 am

arturk wrote: ↑Sat Nov 06, 2021 11:28 pm Fantastic work on locking ring.
How are you progressing on coupling MG1 and MG2 together. Are you planning to come up with something other than welding?

Thank you!
Helical gears are not so easy to measure, to create some sort of locking brackets. Also carrier case is welded, so to install brackets between satellites, you need to remove them first. It is complex process. I think at first I need to make sure this whole power split device locking method is worth it.

I agree, creating locking mechanism could be complicated.
I would love to eliminate/lock power split to reduce need for electric pump (or eliminate it completely) but also eliminate play between all those unnecessary gears in power split and input shaft splines. I got input shaft locked using OEM spline. After driving car for a while i find there is enough play to cause unpleasant clanking noise when switching directions (R>D>R...) and changing between acceleration and deceleration. Also, during take-off (under 20mph) there is little bit of gear whine coming from power split planetary gear set. All that is not terrible and I guess some could get used to it but I am pretty determined to eliminate it or reduce as much as possible.

I retained the entire damper plate with my spline. Do you believe that will protect against some of the clanking you describe?

ggeter wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 11:09 pm

arturk wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 11:06 pm

konstantin8818 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 07, 2021 8:47 am
Thank you!
Helical gears are not so easy to measure, to create some sort of locking brackets. Also carrier case is welded, so to install brackets between satellites, you need to remove them first. It is complex process. I think at first I need to make sure this whole power split device locking method is worth it.

I agree, creating locking mechanism could be complicated.
I would love to eliminate/lock power split to reduce need for electric pump (or eliminate it completely) but also eliminate play between all those unnecessary gears in power split and input shaft splines. I got input shaft locked using OEM spline. After driving car for a while i find there is enough play to cause unpleasant clanking noise when switching directions (R>D>R...) and changing between acceleration and deceleration. Also, during take-off (under 20mph) there is little bit of gear whine coming from power split planetary gear set. All that is not terrible and I guess some could get used to it but I am pretty determined to eliminate it or reduce as much as possible.

I retained the entire damper plate with my spline. Do you believe that will protect against some of the clanking you describe?

With those springs I would expect clunking may be less audible. Again, it is not terrible to begin with. I am just trying to perfect my setup

I wonder if we should change the code to only use MG2 to provide torque until ~25% load. I’ve noticed the same gear whine and lash and it bugs me too. It seems quieter at higher loads in my car which is pretty interesting.

Bryson wrote: ↑Tue Nov 09, 2021 2:16 am I wonder if we should change the code to only use MG2 to provide torque until ~25% load. I’ve noticed the same gear whine and lash and it bugs me too. It seems quieter at higher loads in my car which is pretty interesting.

Interesting idea, I have tried MG2 only on my early test drives. If I remember correctly it helped with gear whine at very low speeds but clunk was still there.
Ultimately I think getting rid of power split is the way to go.
Easier said than done, I know. I really don't like the idea of welding it together.
I have another (spare) transmission and planning to take apart during winter time and try to come up with some solution.
But honestly I hope Konstantin will beat me since he is already working on it

@Bryson / @arturk - How are your cars running? Any updates for the rest of us?

I’ve done about 3000 miles driving daily on mine, no issues at all other than a clunk developing from my rear suspension. Probably too many low gear burnouts ! Longest continuous trip so far was about 170 highway miles there and back.

Another thought regarding the motors. Running one motor at medium load is electrically more efficient than two at lower loads. Theoretically if we just used MG2 for up to 25% torque requests, we could increase highway range slightly.

My other (OEM) EV does this in range mode

Thats amazing. Would love to see some video.

I owe a solid video update, but there are a few existing ones on my latent YouTube channel: https://youtube.com/user/BRV50N

Running MG2 only until we request a certain torque value makes a lot of sense, since we run these motors via a torque request, there shouldn't be an issue with bringing the second motor online.

I'm not sure how the inverter will handle this, however. If we request 0 torque from MG1, will it oppose the movement of MG2? Will it not like being spun with no torque command? Will it try to regen from MG2? How will it know the difference between being spun by MG2 and the car coasting (regenning)?

I did have a think about these things in the early days, but my main focus was on just getting it all working and this seemed to complicate things. However now that everyone has a better understanding, it would be interesting to explore options like this!

xp677 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 09, 2021 7:31 pm Running MG2 only until we request a certain torque value makes a lot of sense, since we run these motors via a torque request, there shouldn't be an issue with bringing the second motor online.

I'm not sure how the inverter will handle this, however. If we request 0 torque from MG1, will it oppose the movement of MG2? Will it not like being spun with no torque command? Will it try to regen from MG2? How will it know the difference between being spun by MG2 and the car coasting (regenning)?

I did have a think about these things in the early days, but my main focus was on just getting it all working and this seemed to complicate things. However now that everyone has a better understanding, it would be interesting to explore options like this!

Yes Tom I'm curious about this too, I have less understanding of it than I would like! IIRC the first chap to use the GS450h in his BMW said he used one motor as a 'dyno' to test the other when developing his conversion. I'd love to see how this was achieved, coding etc, the nitty gritty not just a vague concept! Unfortunately he didn't share much of his know-how - hence Damien set forth on his own path.

But the beauty of this forum is there's lots of progress being made and I have no doubt these things will be achieved sooner or later, thanks to all who are working on it!

Can anyone point me to instructions or a user who has replaced the inverter connector with the Molex set per Damian's Wiki?

https://openinverter.org/wiki/Lexus_GS4 ... Connectors

As much as I'm tempted to rig up some generic pins and epoxy, I'm wondering how daunting re-pinning this thing is, and I've already bought the parts.

Thanks...

-g.

ggeter wrote: ↑Tue Nov 09, 2021 11:23 pm Can anyone point me to instructions or a user who has replaced the inverter connector with the Molex set per Damian's Wiki?

https://openinverter.org/wiki/Lexus_GS4 ... Connectors

As much as I'm tempted to rig up some generic pins and epoxy, I'm wondering how daunting re-pinning this thing is, and I've already bought the parts.

Thanks...

-g.

This wasn't me, however I did replace mine with an Ampseal 34 pin connector. I cut an adapter bracket from a piece of 6mm aluminium sheet. I cut the internal harness as close to the original connector as possible, and soldered them to the back of the connector.

Molex is my preferred connector vendor, but at the time I didn't find a connector which fitted in the space available. These days I would 3D print an extended adapter to use any connector. It would be nice to use an 18-pin high density connector for the resolvers and a 14 pin or whatever for the external connections, to keep the looms tidy. With my setup, it's the same as on the Lexus, where the harness comes in from the car then goes out to the resolvers. Not an issue on Camry inverters.

PatrcioEV-ATX wrote: ↑Tue Nov 09, 2021 5:28 pm @Bryson / @arturk - How are your cars running? Any updates for the rest of us?

Patrcio, I realize video update is long overdue, I promise one in the next few days
In few words I can say could not be happier with this conversion.

Here are some stats.
I have also done around 3000 miles over the last 9 months as daily driver (I do not drive that much really).
My average range is around 2.8 miles/kWh (~4000lbs vehicle) with longest trip just over 100 miles. Keep in mind my pack is only 48kWh and I use around 80% capacity.

Is there a way to just test the inverter, to see if it's good or not. I'm literally going crazy as I can't get things to spin. I tested my throttle and i'm getting a 0 to 495 and I set it via the serial and I loaded the program and have check my wiring 3 times . The only thing I do notice, that I didn't notice before. When Damien turns on the 60v in his test, he got a slight wine - I literally get nothing from mine. - so i'm thinking its a bad invertor. I may need to buy another one. I'm not sure at this point

Gigas wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 2:26 pm Is there a way to just test the inverter, to see if it's good or not. I'm literally going crazy as I can't get things to spin. I tested my throttle and i'm getting a 0 to 495 and I set it via the serial and I loaded the program and have check my wiring 3 times . The only thing I do notice, that I didn't notice before. When Damien turns on the 60v in his test, he got a slight wine - I literally get nothing from mine. - so i'm thinking its a bad invertor. I may need to buy another one. I'm not sure at this point

You should definitely hear high pitch noise from inverter when you apply High Voltage.
I know you checked wiring but you can also cross check against my old and really bad video linked below, perhaps you missed something. Keep in mind it was done with Camry inverter which has slightly different main connector but other than that wiring is the same.

Also, there is HSDN pin to deactivate High Voltage circuit in the inverter which will obviously prevent you from spinning. When left alone inverter should work but if you applied 12V it would deactivate inverter drivers, worth checking.

arturk wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 5:26 pm

Gigas wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 2:26 pm Is there a way to just test the inverter, to see if it's good or not. I'm literally going crazy as I can't get things to spin. I tested my throttle and i'm getting a 0 to 495 and I set it via the serial and I loaded the program and have check my wiring 3 times . The only thing I do notice, that I didn't notice before. When Damien turns on the 60v in his test, he got a slight wine - I literally get nothing from mine. - so i'm thinking its a bad invertor. I may need to buy another one. I'm not sure at this point

You should definitely hear high pitch noise from inverter when you apply High Voltage.
I know you checked wiring but you can also cross check against my old and really bad video linked below, perhaps you missed something. Keep in mind it was done with Camry inverter which has slightly different main connector but other than that wiring is the same.

Also, there is HSDN pin to deactivate High Voltage circuit in the inverter which will obviously prevent you from spinning. When left alone inverter should work but if you applied 12V it would deactivate inverter drivers, worth checking.

Well right now I have the HSDN pin to P on the connector by the mechanical switch - maybe I did something goofy but I'll def recheck it tonight

Gigas wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 6:51 pm

arturk wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 5:26 pm

Gigas wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 2:26 pm Is there a way to just test the inverter, to see if it's good or not. I'm literally going crazy as I can't get things to spin. I tested my throttle and i'm getting a 0 to 495 and I set it via the serial and I loaded the program and have check my wiring 3 times . The only thing I do notice, that I didn't notice before. When Damien turns on the 60v in his test, he got a slight wine - I literally get nothing from mine. - so i'm thinking its a bad invertor. I may need to buy another one. I'm not sure at this point

You should definitely hear high pitch noise from inverter when you apply High Voltage.
I know you checked wiring but you can also cross check against my old and really bad video linked below, perhaps you missed something. Keep in mind it was done with Camry inverter which has slightly different main connector but other than that wiring is the same.

Also, there is HSDN pin to deactivate High Voltage circuit in the inverter which will obviously prevent you from spinning. When left alone inverter should work but if you applied 12V it would deactivate inverter drivers, worth checking.

Well right now I have the HSDN pin to P on the connector by the mechanical switch - maybe I did something goofy but I'll def recheck it tonight

I have mine going to park on the gear position sensor as well and the inverter whine stops when I'm in park. Are you sure you have your voltage cables connected the right way on the inverter? You should definitely hear the whine when the inverter starts up like arturk said.

PatrcioEV-ATX wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 8:00 pm

Gigas wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 6:51 pm

arturk wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 5:26 pm

You should definitely hear high pitch noise from inverter when you apply High Voltage.
I know you checked wiring but you can also cross check against my old and really bad video linked below, perhaps you missed something. Keep in mind it was done with Camry inverter which has slightly different main connector but other than that wiring is the same.

Also, there is HSDN pin to deactivate High Voltage circuit in the inverter which will obviously prevent you from spinning. When left alone inverter should work but if you applied 12V it would deactivate inverter drivers, worth checking.

Well right now I have the HSDN pin to P on the connector by the mechanical switch - maybe I did something goofy but I'll def recheck it tonight

I have mine going to park on the gear position sensor as well and the inverter whine stops when I'm in park. Are you sure you have your voltage cables connected the right way on the inverter? You should definitely hear the whine when the inverter starts up like arturk said.

Yeah I removed the black piece of plastic and hooked positive to one bolt and negative to the other - I'll take a few pics tonight

Anybody DIY their shielded pairs? Damien talks about foil *and* copper wire shielding. Would it be fine for me to just use Cat 8 (cat 7? cat 6?) network cable for all the HF runs from Inverter to VCU/Trans? Or is it just as easy to make these? I'm a noob on HF comms, and I'm thinking each pair needs to be separated and not in the same jacket. Someone please clarify for me.