openinverter forum

My dream is to EV my 2008 Legacy estate. While I would like to do this myself, time, facilities and knowledge mean that the work will probably be outsourced (one day). Meanwhile I am planning things.

I have taken a lot of inspiration from the GT86 by Zapatero:

Motor Nissan Leaf 2014 estimated Power 140KW, 400Nm torque
Battery Pack Leaf 2012 : 24 KWh Battery Pack with 48 modules and 96 cells total.
BMS: Orion BMS 2

The later Leaf batteries have more capacity and allow more power which may be be better for for the larger Legacy, if they will fit in the engine bay, fuel tank and wheel-well locations.

2018 Leaf : 40kWh pack, 24 modules of 8 cells each = 192 cells total. 300x222x68mm 8.7kg Range ~151 miles
2019 Leaf+ : 62kWh pack, 4x27 + 8x12 + 4x21 modules = 288 cells total. Range ~226 miles

Does anyone know the dimensions/weight for the Leaf+ modules ?

I've only just started to look at the BMS. Would it need to manage 288 cells or is it dependent on how they are wired ?

Why not use the stock leaf bms? interfaces easily with open inverter.

what ever number of cells in series is the number of sense leads needed.

all the leaf packs are 96s like most ev packs.


the Subaru 2020 crosstrek hybrid transmission might be a better option. Uncharted territory, but it’s essentially a Subaru version of a gs450h gearbox

Some info here: https://openinverter.org/wiki/Batteries#OEM_modules

24, 30 and 40 kWh have the exact same dimensions, just the 24 pack is split into 48 modules and the 30, 40 pack in 24 modules

I am aiming to keep the mechanical changes to a minimum and the crosstrek hybrid gearbox will be much rarer and probably not powerful enough. Changing the gearbox would require a rear diff change as well.

I am looking for the dimensions of the 62kWh battery pack.

The GT86 project used the Orion bms, I assume there was a good reason.

Scubascooby wrote: ↑Mon Jan 03, 2022 10:24 pm The GT86 project used the Orion bms, I assume there was a good reason.

Back then the Leaf BMS wasn't hacked.

That explains things.

So the Leaf BMS can be used, which might save some money.

Yes, more info here: https://openinverter.org/wiki/Nissan_Leaf_BMS

Already started work on same car , good news is electric power steering is easy to get work. I have done it a bit differently mounted a leaf motor in the rear end on the subframe and hope to add another motor later once I replan packaging as just changed from lithium phosphate battery to a Kona battery. Rikohm has also worked on same car and made a modification to ardustim to simulate a running engine.If I was to start agin I would just use a gs450h motor and do something interesting to get a output for front wheels to make it 4wd.

Also ill be doing a 3d scan for mounting parts I can share that if you need it once I get around to it.

I just did some rough measurements of the wheel well space under the boot floor.

It's a rectangle with a curved front side.
In profile the sides taper and then curve at the bottom.

Length front to back, longest in middle max 68cm
Width, at rear, tapering towards bottom, max 69cm
Width, at front, just before the curved side max 62cm
Width, at rear bottom of curves, 50cm

Depth, at rear centre 28cm max

I had an alternative idea. Not one I plan to implement and I don't think there is space to do it.

Could a motor (like a Tesla) be fitted between the rear diff and the gearbox using a shortened prop shaft ?

I don't know if it's possible to drive a gearbox through the output shaft. Presumably it would have to be locked in one gear to get the axles turning at the same speed.

Can t see the motor fitting like that, leaf motor barely fits in the back after modifying subframe. If you want the easy option I would just used a gs450h gear box

Less than half the power and only 2 wheel drive.

Subaru orginal rear diff and drivesafts won't handle that power seen one explode when one was converted to rwd with just stock diesel engine. I would just go the route of a second motor for the front drive for 4wd.

Far too complex, mechanically and electrically for me. I don't even want to think about how the speed of the two motors would be varied.

I think the 450h parts would be very rare here. Not exactly a big seller.

Subaru diffs and gearboxes are good for over 400bhp so 200 from the Leaf should be fine. The 2.5 turbo models have more than that.

the awd system yes can handle lots of power, but the r160 diffs not so much. The sti has a r180 rear diff, and some people get a r200 from a Nissan for rwd Subarus.

the 2019+ crosstrek hybrid gearbox might be a good option if you can find one. It’s just like the gs450h but with Subarus awd

Scubascooby wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 11:24 am Far too complex, mechanically and electrically for me. I don't even want to think about how the speed of the two motors would be varied.

I think the 450h parts would be very rare here. Not exactly a big seller.

Subaru diffs and gearboxes are good for over 400bhp so 200 from the Leaf should be fine. The 2.5 turbo models have more than that.

I would think the simplest option to keep your Subaru AWD would be just to mount the Leaf motor to your existing gearbox?

The Leaf design is my ambition. Like the GT86 conversion but attached to the 4wd transmission.

From what I can find the 450h gearbox is just 50bhp, hardly enough for a 1.5 ton estate.

These are my basic notes.

Motor:
Nissan Leaf+ 2019
Power 160kW(217 bhp), 340Nm (251 lbft) torque.

Transmission:
Subaru OEM Gearbox
Custom made adaptor plate and coupler.
Rotex GS38 "lovejoy" coupler.

Battery Packs:
2019 Leaf+ 62kWh pack
Modules:
27x4 = 108
+ 12x8 = 96
+ 21x4 = 84
=288 cells total.
Arranged 96s3p
XX x YY x ZZ mm
ww kg, guestimate 313kg total.
EPA range 226 miles

2018 Leaf 40kWh pack
Modules: 24 x 8 cells each, 192 cells total.
300 x 222 x 68 mm
8.7kg, ~209kg total.
EPA range 151 miles

Battery Management System:
Leaf BMS.

Inverter
Nissan Leaf Inverter with Johannes Huebner main board, fully CAN-bus controlled
ResolveEV controller.

ECU
Arduino based replacement ECU for CAN-communication from Geraldjustprojects.com

Scubascooby wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 1:25 pm The Leaf design is my ambition. Like the GT86 conversion but attached to the 4wd transmission.

From what I can find the 450h gearbox is just 50bhp, hardly enough for a 1.5 ton estate.

The GS450H is apparently the same as the LS600H but without the transfer case.
The LS600H motor peak power is 165Kw (220BHP) and peak torque is 300Nm. Max speed is 10,230. According to this:

https://info.ornl.gov/sites/publication ... b26762.pdf

I've been given the gear ratios for the UKDM 2.0D

Main Transmission TY758V1AAB
First Gear Ratio  3.454:1
Second Gear Ratio 1.750:1
Third Gear Ratio 1.096:1
Fourth Gear Ratio 0.785:1
Fifth Gear Ratio  0.634:1
Final Drive Ratio 3.700:1

With my current 215 50 r17 tyres I calculate speed per 1000rpm in each gear to be:

5.9
11.7
18.7
26.1
32.3

I've read that the Leaf motor revs to 10,600rpm and through the Leaf gearbox that gives 94mph. So at a 70mph cruise it would be doing about 8000rpm

Does that mean that the typical rpm range for motorway cruising would be 6000-8000 rpm ?

This post by Dala over on the DIY forum helps to answer my questions about the module sizes. At least it puts upper limits on the dimensions.

https://www.diyelectriccar.com/threads/ ... ck.208654/

PS
These are my guesstimates for the size of the modules:

L x 4 ~= 250 x 370 x 290 mm
M x 4 ~= 250 x 370 x 210 mm
S x 8 ~= 250 x 370 x 120 mm
ww kg, 439.7kg total.

My guesses are that the 4 medium (M) sized batteries would fit in the spare wheel well.

Potentially 4 of the 8 small ones will fit in the fuel tank space. I have no idea if the 4 large ones would then fit around the motor in the engine bay.

Things are moving quickly in the EV world, maybe the Leaf battery & motor is not the best fit.

I still want to retain the Subaru gearbox and drivetrain.