Gs300H in a hybrid setup feasibility

[Jacobsmess]

I'm just wondering about how easy or not it would be to use one of these gearboxes in a hybrid setup.

The reason I ask is battery mounting for the range required isn't entirely feasible for my project van whereas a small battery that will cover short journeys and also provide power when needed is much more possible (offsetting 1 starter and 2 leisure batteries internally also).

Weight wise the GS300H is probably lighter (including the flywheel, starter motor and clutch and it's similar size to my existing gearbox).

The biggest hurdle is an adapter plate and coupler but this shouldn't be impossible given the leaf conversion requires the same fabrication....

Any reason this would be particularly tricky with regards to control/software?

[jrbe]

I have a rule that I follow when I design / build things. Every thing you add likely doubles the complexity and time required to design and build it. This is major function 1 X function 2 X function 3 and on and on.

Adding the hybrid side of things means possible / likely emissions testing, so the whole controls side of things along with emissions equipment needs to be installed. Likely needs a bunch of communications to be reverse engineered to keep it happy. Don't underestimate all the emissions stuff required to do this.

If you're using the combustion engine to drive you need to adjust the speed of one of the x300h transmission motors to adjust the gear ratio. I haven't seen anyone do this yet. It would need fly by wire throttle control of the combustion engine, adjust the gear ratio in the fly, and determine power input between the combustion engine and electric motor. This by itself is quite the undertaking.

Having a range extending combustion engine would likely be more feasible. Still needs all the emissions and controls stuff and a controller to tell it when to run and stop.

A bigger battery is the easier and likely less costly in the long run option.

[Jacobsmess]

I have a rule that I follow when I design / build things. Every thing you add likely doubles the complexity and time required to design and build it. This is major function 1 X function 2 X function 3 and on and on.

Adding the hybrid side of things means possible / likely emissions testing, so the whole controls side of things along with emissions equipment needs to be installed. Likely needs a bunch of communications to be reverse engineered to keep it happy. Don't underestimate all the emissions stuff required to do this.

If you're using the combustion engine to drive you need to adjust the speed of one of the x300h transmission motors to adjust the gear ratio. I haven't seen anyone do this yet. It would need fly by wire throttle control of the combustion engine, adjust the gear ratio in the fly, and determine power input between the combustion engine and electric motor. This by itself is quite the undertaking.

Having a range extending combustion engine would likely be more feasible. Still needs all the emissions and controls stuff and a controller to tell it when to run and stop.

A bigger battery is the easier and likely less costly in the long run option.

So perhaps I should have offered more detail but. My current van is 1993 and had no emsissions testing as a result. It also currently runs on waste vegetable oil, which although still dirty/still requires combustion is better than diesel. The issues with the engine are... it's really noisy, it's dirty and messy, it's polluting and it's very underpowered.

Coupling to a CVT would mean I could get some more usable power out of the engine and the motor.

Its a RWD so the perfect solution would be to swap the rear axle from an existing EV such as a Tesla which would open up space for the batteries beneath but again, the required amount of batteries is high and given a relatively large and brick-ish campervan makes even the biggest OEM packs substandard for range when compared to the range I currently get with the ICE. I estimate I'd roughly get 1.75miles/kWh in this setup, I also often drive to remote areas without charging infrastructure. Currently I get roughly 20-25mpg and it has a 70L tank so roughly 300-350 miles to a tank of fuel, the equivalent of maybe 150kwh of battery storage!

[Jacobsmess]

Also, as I understand the CVT only really requires MG1 to spin backwards to vary the ratio.

[Jacobsmess]

Oh and lastly, the current acceleration is completely mechanical, why would I need fly by wire?

[jrbe]

Emissions aside it's still a lot of work.

Fly by wire throttle will be the combustion engine. You would need to write some code to determine combustion engine on / off, combustion throttle request, gear ratio calculation /table -> mg? direction and speed, and electric drive throttle request. All that for drive. Then the same for regen / decel. When the mg is being used to charge the battery that also skews the drive power.

It's relative, big vehicle = big battery / fuel tank.

A range extender is essentially an onboard generator that would start to charge the battery. Going this route would eliminate all the extra hybrid controls and functions. I'm not aware of any diesel range extenders but there might be some. All the diesel cheating likely scared most / all oems from this direction.

VW TDI engines are efficient, small, and designed to run in a moving vehicle. Swaps can be pretty basic depending on the year. You would have to find or make a controller to start it, check oil pressure / temp / fuel level, battery level, and decide an rpm to run it as a generator, and decide when to shut it off.

There are likely many other combustion options too, some intended already as range extenders.

This case it might be easier to do a whole hybrid swap if the hybrid direction is worth it. Lots of unexpected things will likely pop up.

[arber333]

Oh and lastly, the current acceleration is completely mechanical, why would I need fly by wire?

Hm... i would suggest you take one of those 1.8l BMW boxer motorcycle engines and fit it to gs300h transmission. You need a self sustainable range extender so motorcycle engine is best suited i think.
Regarding control i would just put MG1 in regen in zombie and whenever engine is running... engine throttle i would set to 25% power for start and go to 50% power after engine is warmed up. Maybe a boost switch to go to "mountain mode" 75% if you really need quick power into ev system...

[Jacobsmess]

Hm... i would suggest you take one of those 1.8l BMW boxer motorcycle engines and fit it to gs300h transmission. You need a self sustainable range extender so motorcycle engine is best suited i think.
Regarding control i would just put MG1 in regen in zombie and whenever engine is running... engine throttle i would set to 25% power for start and go to 50% power after engine is warmed up. Maybe a boost switch to go to "mountain mode" 75% if you really need quick power into ev system...

An interesting prospect, it would be nice to keep running waste vegetable oil for the environmental benefit of not using a fossil fuel and also the cost of it. I wonder if I could find a small diesel /multifuel motorbike engine that would run on wvo....

Ideally if using the 300H I'd need the gearing/CVT benefits of running MG1 against the ICE rather than just providing charging as MG2 isn't likely to be able to sling fast enough on its own due to the 3.33 gear reduction.