openinverter forum

Anyone has knowledge how the Outlander heater is operated? Is it CAN based or LIN based control?
I have a good option to get one such heater.

tnx

Is it the Webasto HVH unit?
If so, we enquired at Webasto and of course it was all top secret. Couldn't find hacks either but I'm not great in finding these

johu wrote: ↑Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:53 am Is it the Webasto HVH unit?
If so, we enquired at Webasto and of course it was all top secret. Couldn't find hacks either but I'm not great in finding these

I am completely in the dark about the unit. But Volts Eberspracher SW bus unit is proving hard to crack eventhough people have done it...
I am thinking normal CAN control unit should be easier to crack. We just have to pirate one from operating Outlander.

Anyone?

EDIT: I got some data here, but i dont know if it is correct?
https://www.diyelectriccar.com/threads/ ... ost-334946

It seems heater P/N 7807A053 is CANbus controlled unit and it is connected directly to rear inverter via 20A fuse.
I am waiting for one heater to arrive. So i will first listen to its message.
I got some wiring from Outlander PHEV.

Anyone has Outlander PHEV available? Is possible to spy on CANBUS and turn on heater to see which msg it requires to start?

arber, I might be able to help you but probably not... I've been pulling CAN logs from a wrecked 2019 model before I take it apart. Tried to capture the electric heater, got very confused when it never got hot in EV mode. Then took out the passenger seat and discovered this Outlander doesn't have the electric water heater option!

If you turn on the heater in EV mode with cold coolant, the electric heater pump still runs. So there is a small chance it still sends the right CAN message for the heater control even though there is no heater. If I have a useful log for you, it's here: https://github.com/projectgus/mitsubish ... pt-ev-mode

projectgus wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:36 am arber, I might be able to help you but probably not... I've been pulling CAN logs from a wrecked 2019 model before I take it apart. Tried to capture the electric heater, got very confused when it never got hot in EV mode. Then took out the passenger seat and discovered this Outlander doesn't have the electric water heater option!

If you turn on the heater in EV mode with cold coolant, the electric heater pump still runs. So there is a small chance it still sends the right CAN message for the heater control even though there is no heater. If I have a useful log for you, it's here: https://github.com/projectgus/mitsubish ... pt-ev-mode

Thank you for your logs.
I noticed ID 0x185 which is an AC request. I have seen this expression online...
canID 0x185 08 04 20 00 00 00 00 00

I have to try some msgs effect on heater

Good, I'm glad they're useful. There are some notes in the readme from what I noticed so far - 0x185 correlates with both AC and heater but doesn't seem to correlate with AC compressor cycles. 0x188 might correlate with heater. 0x388 directly correlates to AC compressor cycles.

I'm hoping to get the compressor out in the next week or so, and figure out its behaviour as well.

Good luck!

projectgus wrote: ↑Fri Aug 27, 2021 9:26 am Good, I'm glad they're useful. There are some notes in the readme from what I noticed so far - 0x185 correlates with both AC and heater but doesn't seem to correlate with AC compressor cycles. 0x188 might correlate with heater. 0x388 directly correlates to AC compressor cycles.

I'm hoping to get the compressor out in the next week or so, and figure out its behaviour as well.

Good luck!

Yes i have seen that 0x388 is AC report on compressor status. I will also try 0x188. It seems AC and heater are higher on the CAN list of commands even that motor traction requests.

I think i will have more time through the weekend to play with heater. I appreciate the help with AC compressor since i still dont have it here.

projectgus wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:36 am arber, I might be able to help you but probably not... I've been pulling CAN logs from a wrecked 2019 model before I take it apart. Tried to capture the electric heater, got very confused when it never got hot in EV mode. Then took out the passenger seat and discovered this Outlander doesn't have the electric water heater option!

If you turn on the heater in EV mode with cold coolant, the electric heater pump still runs. So there is a small chance it still sends the right CAN message for the heater control even though there is no heater. If I have a useful log for you, it's here: https://github.com/projectgus/mitsubish ... pt-ev-mode

Hi
I cant seem to open ny of your logs. Can you repost them? I only get 3 lines in each csv file as if github would delete your content...

Oh, how annoying. They're hosted on GitHub using Git LFS (Large File Storage) because GitHub has a file size limit for "normal" files and some of these files are larger than the limit. It looks like the GitHub website doesn't do LFS support so you just see the three line "pointer" file if you view the log file on there.

To get up and running with LFS quickly then installing GitHub Desktop and cloning the repo to your computer should work. GitHub Desktop app includes LFS support.

If you're still stuck then let me know and I'll post them somewhere else as well.

projectgus wrote: ↑Mon Aug 30, 2021 1:35 am
If you're still stuck then let me know and I'll post them somewhere else as well.

Yes, i tried to clone repo but it kept refusing. Really annoying i would think gzip would be enough... Can you please post two heater files somewhere? Tnx

Weird, that's annoying. I guess LFS isn't the simple solution that I thought it was. I've recreated without LFS enabled and split the large log, unfortunately you'll have to clone it again but it should definitely work now.

I think the heater is sorted: https://openinverter.org/wiki/Webasto_HVH50

johu wrote: ↑Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:43 pm I think the heater is sorted: https://openinverter.org/wiki/Webasto_HVH50

No! The one i got is CAN bus controlled with 4 pin connector. Top two pins are 12V(1) and GND(2) and other two CANh(3) and CANl(4).
I provided schematic pic with connector marked in red.
When 12V is connected i got 4 CAN telegram reports on 500kbaud.

0x398 ID 00 09 00 3B 3B 00 00 00 at 100ms
0x630 ID 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 at 500ms
0x062D ID 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 at 500ms
0x06BD ID 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 at 500ms

This is without HV connected!

I haven't seen pictures above becouse of connection restrictions at work. Now i know my pinout was wrong.
Sorry for mistake.

I have connected HV to the heater. I did not yet fill it with coolant.
HV cable orientation is Positive contact inside inverter on the side of 30A fuse.
When i connected HV sole change was in the 0x398 telegram. Now i got:

0x398 ID 00 00 00 3B 3B 00 00 00 at 100ms

I need to provide coolant and pump!

projectgus wrote: ↑Mon Aug 30, 2021 10:39 am Weird, that's annoying. I guess LFS isn't the simple solution that I thought it was. I've recreated without LFS enabled and split the large log, unfortunately you'll have to clone it again but it should definitely work now.

Got the files now thanks. I am seeing a possible 1st byte in 0x185 gets set from 00 to 08.
Also i see at the same time 1st byte in 0x188 changes from 00 to 02. Either of them might be heater request. Will try when i set up coolant, pump and 12V.

arber333 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 31, 2021 6:50 am

projectgus wrote: ↑Mon Aug 30, 2021 10:39 am Weird, that's annoying. I guess LFS isn't the simple solution that I thought it was. I've recreated without LFS enabled and split the large log, unfortunately you'll have to clone it again but it should definitely work now.

Got the files now thanks. I am seeing a possible 1st byte in 0x185 gets set from 00 to 08.
Also i see at the same time 1st byte in 0x188 changes from 00 to 02. Either of them might be heater request. Will try when i set up coolant, pump and 12V.

Did you get anywhere with this @arber? I now have an Outlander heater and now that the car is road legal, making it warm has become a priority!

@arber, do I have the polarity right? Based on the photo here https://www.myoutlanderphev.com/forum/v ... hp?p=33926 My 0x398 differs from yours, but I have no water in there, it's completely dry. https://openinverter.org/wiki/Mitsubish ... ter_Heater I've started a wiki page for confirmed information.
Thanks

0x398 has the water temperature in byte 3. I filled mine with water from the kettle. Byte 4 also seems to be a temperature, might be device temp? http://www.mhi.co.jp/technology/review/ ... 542057.pdf says they have built in ECU, with:

• High Voltage measuring

• Current Measuring

• Parts Temperature

• Water Temperature

Ive replayed 202108081224-heater-attempt-ev-mode.csv to it, all that happens is byte 0 of 0x398 becomes 0x01. No water temperature heat or current flow.

It looks like it's 0x285 that causes this. Replaying only 0x285 results in the first byte becoming 01.

i managed to get my ac pump running from this though the 285 message is needed for the aircon pump it changes the last bit of message 0x388 from the pump. I think 285 is like a master control message maybe signalling that the drive battery is connected. it is needed to use the charger units, the inverters and the ac pump i have.

Bigpie wrote: ↑Mon Oct 11, 2021 9:54 am @arber, do I have the polarity right? Based on the photo here https://www.myoutlanderphev.com/forum/v ... hp?p=33926
20211011_131536.jpg20211011_105258.jpg

Sorry didnt catch that msg.
Yes the + marked connector is the positive and if you observe how it connects you will notice it is connected through the fuse. On the original schematic you should see fuses are on the + side.

RAS_666 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 16, 2021 12:48 pm i managed to get my ac pump running from this though the 285 message is needed for the aircon pump it changes the last bit of message 0x388 from the pump. I think 285 is like a master control message maybe signalling that the drive battery is connected. it is needed to use the charger units, the inverters and the ac pump i have.

I think you are right about 0x285 being a general status message, at a glance, it looks like byte 5 is HV voltage.
I've asked just about everywhere I can think of for more logs but will play some more.

i just tried bare minimum can messages to control my ac pump and found all it needed is 0x285 and 0x185 sent at 10 ms think 185 is fine at much lower rates but it definatly wouldnt work properly with 285 at lower speeds.

i also thinned out the 0x285 message and it appears the ac only needs the last 2 bytes to work basically sent it 285 00 00 00 00 00 00 0C 10 i will make a post about the ac pump. maybe if someone could connect a heater to an outlander to see what happens could be tapped into the can in the boot on either the inverter or charger and connected to the space power connector on the inverter?