BMW i3 CCS/charge port controller

[tom91]

ooh thank you, that is very interesting. my voltage sense board is going off when my car is off.
how is your door contact connected? or just always in "open" state? and when you need to performe the weld test you close the contact manualy?

How much does your voltage sense board draw? I measured a BMW I3 LIM current draw once it cycles down, it is very low. At this moment however we do not wake and shut it down properly over canbus using the Power Management CAN bus message, 0x12f.

It might be possible to shutdown the BMW I3 CCS Controller and then shut down the Sense Board.

[bitterandreal]

How much does your voltage sense board draw? I measured a BMW I3 LIM current draw once it cycles down, it is very low. At this moment however we do not wake and shut it down properly over canbus using the Power Management CAN bus message, 0x12f.

It might be possible to shutdown the BMW I3 CCS Controller and then shut down the Sense Board.

I have not measured the voltage sense board consumption but I guess it is very low.
You have to check with your sensor supplier.
The LIM might not need a voltage reading when asleep but I don't mind the extra consumption for now.

[muehlpower]

In message 0x272 the status of the contactors is easily recognizable. My software automatically does a weld test if the message doesn't say ok

[uhi22]

Side topic: If somebody wants to find out, which data is flowing between the LIM and the charger, there is now the toolchain ready. The idea is to use a logic analyzer (Saleae or clone), record the SPI at the QCA7005, and the rest is python. More details here: viewtopic.php?p=57540#p57540

[nathaniel]

In message 0x272 the status of the contactors is easily recognizable. My software automatically does a weld test if the message doesn't say ok

Yes that was my idea, but the problem I have with that is at every start the cp_door status is in error. I need to cycle the door to get it to read open or close. And the welding test don't start before cp_door is closed.
But for the record, I don't need to do the welding test every time but every so often.
I can set a relay on the CP_door contact and toggle when I read error. But I hope there is a better way to do so.

Also I use the zombie vcu only for the LIM, so it is always in off state. And I have a switch to toggle start when I want to perform the welding test. And the zvcu is sending the message to the LIM that it needs to sleep most of the time. But then I put 12 volt on the wake-up line when I turn on the car... Hmm maybe it get upset with that. But I need the 12 volt on the wake-up line otherwise the AC and DC charging is not working. Zvcu needs to be in off state before I can charge, or it goes into off state when you put the plug in the car..

My sense board uses 10 or 15ma but it's adds up quick if you have a couple of those users of course.

[muehlpower]

my system is completely de-energized (LIM, controller, sensing board) and is controlled by a charge control button. This starts the controller via 12V. After that, the controller keeps itself alive while charging and turns itself off when charging is not started or charging is complete.. The flapdoor is simulated with a transistor. "off means off". Only the electric clock is always powered.

[alexbeatle]

Just wanted to share this with you guys, I got ccs working thanks of your help! I installed small relays that switches the big ones and that did the trick. Strange thing is that I use 30 ohm resistors because that was the only thing I had. But the LIM is accepting that it seems. Swapped the current sensor values but my sensor reads about 10% higher then the charger but that seems also not a problem.

What small relays did you use?
And do you know if there're special requirements for the small relays?
It looks like the idea is to put 15ohm resistors (in your case 30ohm), in parallel with the coil of the small ones to simulate the bmw original contactors. But if I remember correctly resistance in parallel is:
1/Rt = 1/R1 + 1/R2.
So unless the coil resistance is much larger than that of 15ohms, LIM won't see 15ohm resistance. Or am I not understanding something?

I have large TE contactors - EV200 https://www.te.com/usa-en/product-1618002-7.html
They have economisers as small external units on the side of their bodies and easy to detach. The coil resistance is 3ohms without the economiser. I wonder if I can use them with the 15ohm resistors somehow. Has anybody tried this?
Thanks in advance.

[bitterandreal]

What small relays did you use?
And do you know if there're special requirements for the small relays?
It looks like the idea is to put 15ohm resistors (in your case 30ohm), in parallel with the coil of the small ones to simulate the bmw original contactors. But if I remember correctly resistance in parallel is:
1/Rt = 1/R1 + 1/R2.
So unless the coil resistance is much larger than that of 15ohms, LIM won't see 15ohm resistance. Or am I not understanding something?

I have large TE contactors - EV200 https://www.te.com/usa-en/product-1618002-7.html
They have economisers as small external units on the side of their bodies and easy to detach. The coil resistance is 3ohms without the economiser. I wonder if I can use them with the 15ohm resistors somehow. Has anybody tried this?
Thanks in advance.

For a test I used 17ohm resistors in parallel with a small pre switching relay which had a much higher resistance.
Putting a series resistor next to the EV200 won't work. The EV200 needs more power than the LIM can handle.

[bitterandreal]

@muehlpower How dit you decode the programmed LIM parameters in E-Sys?
If I try to edit them in the FDL-Editor I don't see parameter names.
Have you been using the BimmerUtility to map the CAFD?

[muehlpower]

@muehlpower How dit you decode the programmed LIM parameters in E-Sys?
If I try to edit them in the FDL-Editor I don't see parameter names.
Have you been using the BimmerUtility to map the CAFD?

Hello, I'm a bit overwhelmed with your questions. I clicked on CAFD, Edit NCD and then the "Functions" page came up. There I found settings for US or EU, LEDs, PWM for the DC contactor etc. but nothing about a 125A limit.

[bitterandreal]

Hello, I'm a bit overwhelmed with your questions. I clicked on CAFD, Edit NCD and then the "Functions" page came up. There I found settings for US or EU, LEDs, PWM for the DC contactor etc. but nothing about a 125A limit.

Thanks for your reply. Too bad there is no current limit parameter.
I just don't understand why I don't see the parameter names. In the bimmerpost forum they advised to use bimmerutility to decode the parameter names. https://www.bimmerutility.com/fdl-editor

[muehlpower]

Have you or anyone tried charging more than 125A? In my estimation, there are two parameters to consider. 2F1h 16/8 and 3E9h 40/8

[evMacGyver]

How much LIM HV measurement may differ from reality before chargers get upset? Did some testing with high voltage supply and LIM reads maybe 3% lower values, like supplied 280V measures 272V. Not sure was my 5V supply good enough for the measurement board, about the same difference was with lower test voltages too.

I did have all CCS components installed last summer, but I was fine with sloooow charge then and I did not get deeper into LIM stuff and now I would need to get it working. Need to add charge door close switch for weld test and ..

[bitterandreal]

Have you or anyone tried charging more than 125A? In my estimation, there are two parameters to consider. 2F1h 16/8 and 3E9h 40/8

I tried and had no success to go above 125A but maybe I'm still missing a limit.

[Shockazulu1]

I tried and had no success to go above 125A but maybe I'm still missing a limit.

I believe the BMW i3 was never meant to charge at more than 125 amp.
The wires at the connector are 2awg, so only rated for 125 amp max.
On the bright side, charging faster will cause more stress on the batteries.

[tom91]

I have done testing and yes you can ask for more then 125A, got a setup in car up to 166A under test. The BMW I3 LIM does not really care.

One thing to note, some chargers are picky that you cannot say the Car Side current limit is higher then the reported Charger Side current limit.

Ofcourse for the final deployment I will limit the charging rate to 125A due to contactors and fuses fitted.

[Shockazulu1]

Here are the two LIMs used the 2017 gave issues and the 2020 worked.

Will dig into the can captures to see if there are any differences.

IMG-20220701-WA0000.jpg

tom91,
Have you been able to use your 2017 LIM?
In the wiki that version doesn't state weather it works or not with CCS.

[tom91]

tom91,
Have you been able to use your 2017 LIM?
In the wiki that version doesn't state weather it works or not with CCS.

This was a customer not myself.

I have a project using a 2018-09 ECU 6135-9494498-01 working with CCS.

[Shockazulu1]

Sorry no can logs this time. I just commented out the contactor test at the end of state 5 so I could charge. Drove nearly 500miles over 3 days of house hunting lots of ccs sessions. Those 2 circontrol stations are located about 50 miles apart. #1 works fine. Charged all the way to 91% this morning and terminated the charge myself. Other one goes to 80% and when I try to restart drops from state 6 to 7 and shuts down. Tritium works fine with contactor test commented out. I will try and do some more logging but bigger fish to fry at the minute:)

Can someone point me in the direction to learn how to "comment out" something like this?

[Shockazulu1]

For the charger cable lock motor and position sensor.
On the wiki I found 3 wiring diagrams.
All 3 have conflicting arrangements.
I'm noting that for the position sensor one drawing uses a ground, one uses one of the current for the lock motor, the last drawing uses a ground and one of the currents for the lock motor at the same time.
What drawing is correct. I'm working on CCS1 in the USA if that makes a difference.
I'm also using a BMW i3 CCS1 charge port with lock motor and switch.

[muehlpower]

The first two pictures show the same thing, a bridge between pin3 and pin4 on the port, which are connected to pin5 on the LIM. It's the same with the I3. The second picture is only important if the resistors are not already installed in the charge port, which is not the case with your original BMW port. Damien did it to put pin4 on ground and it seems to work. To be clear again: picture 1 is crucial for you.

[christoph]

This problem is still there, tried with another station of the same kind. I've seen that tom91 had exactly that problem where the precharge voltage was there but contactors wouldn't close. I think Jack Bauer pointed him that he did set the maximum A in 0x2F1 to 0 which apparently was the cause. This doesn't seem to be my problem, though...

Problem is solved!

That did the trick
https://github.com/cschleifenbaum/Stm32 ... 2e71f6ef55

The charge disliked that the maximum voltage was changed during pre-charge.

[Shockazulu1]

I am guessing all who have got this working successfully are from Europe.
I have looked through all the post and haven't found any poster from the USA using CCS1 who has had success getting this to work.
Not all posters have their profiles updated with their country location, but I looked through their history of posts to try to figure out what country they were from.
Several times it is said that CCS1 is similar to CCS2 and should work.
But my experience so far is it will not go beyond state 1, and faults out before it does a contractor test.
I have 4 charger locations from 3 different companies that I have tried.
I also have a BMW i3 that I have verified does work on all the chargers with my payment accounts.
I have compared my canbus logs to Damien's and that is how I figured out where it is stopping.
It could just be in my settings in the Zombieverter, I'm directly tapping into my traction battery right after the main contractors, in a vehicle that wasn't originally sold with a fast charging option. So no bms, or canbus connection to the vehicle.
Was trying to get this to work with just the isa shunt, voltage sensor, original i3 port with its smaller contractors, i3 LIM, and Zombieverter.
I can apply high voltage to the port side and create a weld fault, then perform a contractor test that clears the fault.
My ISA shunt has 3 voltage inputs and they show up in Zombieverter udc,udc2,udc3, but I'm unsure were to connect udc2 and udc3 or if udc2 and udc3 are even needed. Since most drawings show these connected on both sides of the main contractors. I can't access my main contractors inside the batter so I simply turn on the car to put it in ready mode to have the main contractors close.
I'm looking at 3 possibilities.
1. Has anyone been successful with CCS1?
2. I need to connect udc2 and udc3 to something even if I can't access the main contractors?
3. I may have wrong choices selected in Zombieverter for example charge mode=Ext Can, interface =i3 LIM?
I've worked on this work quiet a bit and am almost ready to just go with chadamo port since I have everything for that option already. Just need to enable canbus3 on the Zombieverter.
All the chargers near me have a chadamo and CCS1 option. But I want CCS1 due to the likelihood that chadamo will be phased out someday.
Long post but basically 3 questions, I think.

[uhi22]

Sorry, not answering your questions, but in case the LIM solution does not fit, you could have a look to foccci here viewtopic.php?p=64470#p64470 Would be great to test it with CCS1.

[Shockazulu1]

Sorry, not answering your questions, but in case the LIM solution does not fit, you could have a look to foccci here viewtopic.php?p=64470#p64470 Would be great to test it with CCS1.

I have been fallowing this thread, but nobody has it actually working yet.
I'm just trying all I can, to get the CCS1 to work with the i3 LIM.
Plan B, I will run go to chadamo and come back to CCS1 once someone has a way to get it to work.