The honda insight IMA inverter Topic is solved

[Ryclanmoto]

Good afternoon, I bought an inverter from Honda Insight

[Ryclanmoto]

We continue disassembling the inverter, the top cover is held on by 4 bolts , Also disassembling current sensors

[tom91]

https://endless-sphere.com/sphere/threa ... ep.119952/

[Jacobsmess]

Same as the honda IMA I think. They have been reverse engineered for some time
Edit: as Tom points out

[tom91]

Same as the honda IMA I think

You mean civic. No turns out there are slight difference but not massive. So the information on the Endless Sphere forum will be useful.

[Ryclanmoto]

Same as the honda IMA I think. They have been reverse engineered for some time
Edit: as Tom points out

Not exactly, the Civic inverter has logic already inside the inverter, I may be wrong, but the inverters are Insight, Jazz,Fit, you can run it directly through the connector, the PWM signals come from a separate block!!!

[tom91]

the PWM signals come from a separate block!!!

Thats how Toyota done the early priaiii (plural of prius) too so it seems very possible. I would mean getting control over the inverter power stage should be "relatively" straight forward once signals are identified and mapped.

[Ryclanmoto]

Thats how Toyota done the early priaiii (plural of prius) too so it seems very possible. I would mean getting control over the inverter power stage should be "relatively" straight forward once signals are identified and mapped.

Yes, I am working on it, for now we have a diagram like this, a little later, after some time I will make inscriptions based on the photo, more detailed instructions, as I understand it, the inverter is from a Honda Civic, the capacitors are designed For voltages up to 600 В , but Honda insight has 450 volt capacitors , I couldn't find more detailed information on the capacities

Special thanks to a good friend for providing the photo.

Module IGBT For voltages of 600 and 300 А

[Ryclanmoto]

[Ryclanmoto]

The pinout of the current sensors is ready, let's move on along the path

[Ryclanmoto]

[arber333]

Hi i have one such inverter here and i would like to make it run OI. Can you elaborate on the signals that you determined pins with?

VCC - how much voltage? Is that 12V or 5V?
PWM are open collector signals (pulled up) or true voltage signals? Which level are they, 12V, 5V or 3V3?
What is IPUA signal?
Any idea on side connector P/N
EDIT: I see connector here, but rows are squed.... https://connector.pinoutguide.com/12_pi ... _Unit_MIC/
This one looks like the real thing:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005009 ... in_prod%3A

I will use my own current sensors for this...

tnx
Arber

[Ryclanmoto]

VCC This voltage is 12 volts, powered by a battery, Ipua This is an error signal

[arber333]

VCC This voltage is 12 volts, powered by a battery, Ipua This is an error signal

What is the IPUA signal level when active? Is it GND level or positive?

tnx

[Ryclanmoto]

What is the IPUA signal level when active? Is it GND level or positive?

tnx

Upua is the TX UART contact; the inverter communicates with the native control unit through it. The inverter operates and starts without it, with operating voltage up to 240 V, then it shuts off. Some guys have removed the overvoltage protection, but then the capacitor voltage limit will reach 450 V. If you're on Telegram and ready to talk, you can find me at ex400rus. IMA inverters for motorcycles and ATVs (Honda Insight 2nd generation, Honda Fit, Honda CRZ, Honda Jazz, Honda Civic, Honda Freed)

[Ryclanmoto]

From the entire list, only one inverter has logic, the Honda civic, the rest of the inverters take PWM from the control unit, they are easier to start, but the Honda insight, crz, jazz, fit inverters have an external current sensor, since the Honda civic current sensors are already in the inverter itself!!!

[arber333]

Upua is the TX UART contact; the inverter communicates with the native control unit through it. The inverter operates and starts without it, with operating voltage up to 240 V, then it shuts off. Some guys have removed the overvoltage protection, but then the capacitor voltage limit will reach 450 V. If you're on Telegram and ready to talk, you can find me at ex400rus. IMA inverters for motorcycles and ATVs (Honda Insight 2nd generation, Honda Fit, Honda CRZ, Honda Jazz, Honda Civic, Honda Freed)

I am building a Lebowski small board with bare minimum interface pins.
My intent is to use the same board with IMA 1B210RBJ0131 and 1B300RMX0031 units. the way Romale shows here...
https://openinverter.org/forum/viewtopi ... 680#p56680
With small one i will need to use external current sensors, but i have old Chevy Volt sensors laying around.
I will connect to drivers via some wires connected to the board through Molex connectors.
I ordered the 12p side connector so i will be able to connect directly to drivers there.

I hope to be testing this soon. Will post results here...

Since Lebowski is PMSM FOC i wouldnt be able to test ACIM motors... for that is OI then

[arber333]

.... The inverter operates and starts without it, with operating voltage up to 240 V, then it shuts off. Some guys have removed the overvoltage protection, but then the capacitor voltage limit will reach 450 V. .....

Ok you peaked my interest now. I have some questions...
1. Does this particular inverter stop by itself at voltage more than 240Vdc?

2. Cap limit is 450Vdc? How did they remove overvoltage protection?

3. What would be the current limit? What is limit on current sensors?
I see Mitsu ct300djg060 IGBTs can carry 300A at 600V. I would assume 250A at some 400Vdc?

[Ryclanmoto]

Ok you peaked my interest now. I have some questions...
1. Does this particular inverter stop by itself at voltage more than 240Vdc?
Yes, it stops, there is voltage protection for the Honda Insight inverter, there is no protection for the Honda Civic inverter, and it can operate up to 550 volts

2. Cap limit is 450Vdc? How did they remove overvoltage protection?

I can 't tell you , but rather by soldering

3. What would be the current limit? What is limit on current sensors?
I see Mitsu ct300djg060 IGBTs can carry 300A at 600V. I would assume 250A at some 400Vdc?

400 V 220 A

[marcexec]

the current sensors can take a bit over 300A: https://endless-sphere.com/sphere/threa ... st-1764979

[Ryclanmoto]

the current sensors can take a bit over 300A: https://endless-sphere.com/sphere/threa ... st-1764979

Well, it will be possible to adjust how Roman did it, add a resistor, the Honda Civic is an excellent inverter, due to the built-in current sensors in the inverter itself

In the future, I plan to introduce an inverter into a motorcycle with a Nissan engine.

[Ryclanmoto]

I am building a Lebowski small board with bare minimum interface pins.
My intent is to use the same board with IMA 1B210RBJ0131 and 1B300RMX0031 units. the way Romale shows here...
https://openinverter.org/forum/viewtopi ... 680#p56680
With small one i will need to use external current sensors, but i have old Chevy Volt sensors laying around.
I will connect to drivers via some wires connected to the board through Molex connectors.
I ordered the 12p side connector so i will be able to connect directly to drivers there.

I hope to be testing this soon. Will post results here...

Since Lebowski is PMSM FOC i wouldnt be able to test ACIM motors... for that is OI then

But the connectors are different, they differ from Insight and Civic

Удачи в запуске , Ждем результатов

[arber333]

But the connectors are different, they differ from Insight and Civic

Now why would a thing like that stop men like us?

Just waiting for boards from JLCPCB...

EDIT: I may have made a mistake with precharge control. I didnt account on START command from key, only 12V from enable. Starting will have to be done from latching relay pair....

[arber333]

Well Lebowski board starts precharge and after about 1.5s it turns ON main contactor. Then all leds go back and forth as menus are not populated yet.
I will get this connected to the larger IMA inverter in similar way Romale did his OI interface.

Later on i will use another set of connectors to interface the smaller Insight inverter. I need to find suitable current sensors. For testing i will use Ampera/Volt 700A triple current sensors, but i imagine they will be overkill here.

Does anyone know a good 300A triple sensors replacement with 0 - 5V signal?