Daihatsu Fourtrak
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm
Daihatsu Fourtrak
Ok, figured i should start a thread, i've started measuring up and i've started battery pack sums, also started stripping down a non-running test bed vehicle to keep my daily driver on the road as long as possible
This is the vehicle in question, a Daihatsu Fourtrak, the P reg on the left specifically. The Y reg on the right is in worse shape and not roadworthy, it'll serve as a test bed for battery box and motor fitment.
It has selectable High-Low and 4wd transfer box. I doubt i'll need the Low range gears but i do want the 4wd.
Technically a 7 seater, i want to definitely retain 5 seats and i would like 100 miles of range, even if not off the bat.
Reason for this vehicle given it's age (23 years now); i have fallen in love (hence buying a second when the first started to overheat), it's as capable as a LR Defender but not as tall, so no climbing in and out, it takes plenty of people, it's rugged, has great off road capability, a bomb proof transmission and are somewhat rare over here now.
The kerb weight is 1670kg, the engine weighs 250-300kg (by all accounts), the fuel tank must be 70kg+ when full, plus the exhaust to lose and a GVWR of 2510kg, i think i've got a decent weight headroom for this project.
As for battery placement, i have the fuel tank spot, between the left chassis rail and the shaft, behind the rear seats and a big deep square engine bay, all pictured here, if i look at gen 2 leaf modules i think i can fit 96 of them in. Which should give me 48kWh, which should give me me 100 mile range.
I might not be able to to afford them all up front, so i might be looking at half of that to get on the road and upgrade later
(rear seats missing in this picture)
This is the vehicle in question, a Daihatsu Fourtrak, the P reg on the left specifically. The Y reg on the right is in worse shape and not roadworthy, it'll serve as a test bed for battery box and motor fitment.
It has selectable High-Low and 4wd transfer box. I doubt i'll need the Low range gears but i do want the 4wd.
Technically a 7 seater, i want to definitely retain 5 seats and i would like 100 miles of range, even if not off the bat.
Reason for this vehicle given it's age (23 years now); i have fallen in love (hence buying a second when the first started to overheat), it's as capable as a LR Defender but not as tall, so no climbing in and out, it takes plenty of people, it's rugged, has great off road capability, a bomb proof transmission and are somewhat rare over here now.
The kerb weight is 1670kg, the engine weighs 250-300kg (by all accounts), the fuel tank must be 70kg+ when full, plus the exhaust to lose and a GVWR of 2510kg, i think i've got a decent weight headroom for this project.
As for battery placement, i have the fuel tank spot, between the left chassis rail and the shaft, behind the rear seats and a big deep square engine bay, all pictured here, if i look at gen 2 leaf modules i think i can fit 96 of them in. Which should give me 48kWh, which should give me me 100 mile range.
I might not be able to to afford them all up front, so i might be looking at half of that to get on the road and upgrade later
(rear seats missing in this picture)
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
Tractor was not completely ideal, but the engine, bell housing and gearbox are out
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
I think it might have been better to manoeuvre the test mule before removing the engine
Until i've got cash to bring some parts in i can play with figuring out the instrument cluster wiring
I've had the temp and fuel gauges moving, using an arduino (viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1311)
Thinking Temp gauge for Inverter temp, or would it be better to use for motor temp?
Fuel gauge for rough SoC
Warning light for inverter error
Glow plug light for pre-charge
Alternator light for DC-DC
Then i also have an oil warning light and a fuel/water drain light i could use, not sure if anything fits the latter particularly well
Until i've got cash to bring some parts in i can play with figuring out the instrument cluster wiring
I've had the temp and fuel gauges moving, using an arduino (viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1311)
Thinking Temp gauge for Inverter temp, or would it be better to use for motor temp?
Fuel gauge for rough SoC
Warning light for inverter error
Glow plug light for pre-charge
Alternator light for DC-DC
Then i also have an oil warning light and a fuel/water drain light i could use, not sure if anything fits the latter particularly well
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
As for parts plan, i have swung to and fro with a Leaf stack setup or a GS450H setup, i've had a thread here and on DIYelectriccar about both, with regards to retaining for 4wd capability. Although the GS450H would save some of the engine bay for batteries, i think it's geared wrong for this application, if i've keeping the existing xfer case gear ratio. So i'm currently back on a Leaf setup.
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
The fuel tank is out and this is the space available,
roughly 750x500x270mm
Here is the exhaust space, seem to have not make a note of the space here
How do people deal with underbody battery boxes, access wise, my options are
A) no access once in place, just have cables exiting box that I terminate up front
B) a rear facing access panel (or whole side of the box comes off)
C) I cut the boot floor in, although that's less of an option for the exhaust space box because of seats
roughly 750x500x270mm
Here is the exhaust space, seem to have not make a note of the space here
How do people deal with underbody battery boxes, access wise, my options are
A) no access once in place, just have cables exiting box that I terminate up front
B) a rear facing access panel (or whole side of the box comes off)
C) I cut the boot floor in, although that's less of an option for the exhaust space box because of seats
-
- Posts: 656
- Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:50 pm
- Location: Northern California, USA
- Been thanked: 1 time
- Contact:
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
I'd suggest using the temperature gauge for inverter temp. The motor is usually hotter/can tolerate more heat, while the inverter being made of silicon is rather more sensitive.
-Isaac
-Isaac
- johu
- Site Admin
- Posts: 5831
- Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:52 pm
- Location: Kassel/Germany
- Has thanked: 162 times
- Been thanked: 1045 times
- Contact:
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
I mounted the battery using Nissans structural elements only: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=32&start=125#p3033Greenbeast wrote: ↑Sun Jan 17, 2021 11:51 am How do people deal with underbody battery boxes, access wise, my options are
A) no access once in place, just have cables exiting box that I terminate up front
B) a rear facing access panel (or whole side of the box comes off)
C) I cut the boot floor in, although that's less of an option for the exhaust space box because of seats
That way the surrounding plastic has no structural task but only weather protection and can be removed for service: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=32&start=200#p6259
All TÜV approved.
Support R/D and forum on Patreon: https://patreon.com/openinverter - Subscribe on odysee: https://odysee.com/@openinverter:9
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
Smart, i must have missed that postjohu wrote: ↑Sun Jan 17, 2021 6:32 pm I mounted the battery using Nissans structural elements only: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=32&start=125#p3033
That way the surrounding plastic has no structural task but only weather protection and can be removed for service: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=32&start=200#p6259
All TÜV approved.
Good thought, thank you
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
Ok, so much like the stock fuel tank, in fact. That is mounted and then has a shield mounted over the top (underneath), obviously it's very open because it's primarily for debris and not water protection.
-
- Posts: 89
- Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 10:26 am
- Location: Nederland
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 4 times
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
Hi,
Just wanted to let you know that I am also working on a EV conversion for the Fourtrack/Rocky. My aproach is using the Nissan Leaf motor and inverter.
From what I could see on the Mercedes G conversion (also on this forum) it looks like the setup directly onto the transferbox should work, either in high or low (or both). We need to do tests to see how much the current drain would be in both cases.
Note: I will use the motor assembly from a 2015 Leaf. Not sure if I can use the EM61 instead of the EM57 with the 2015 inverter/charger setup.
But it is easy to make the EM57 also fit to the transfercase.
(update)
I decided to go for the EM57 stack directly mounted to the main gearbox. We test fitted the stack and all seems to locate well. Regards,
Paul
Just wanted to let you know that I am also working on a EV conversion for the Fourtrack/Rocky. My aproach is using the Nissan Leaf motor and inverter.
From what I could see on the Mercedes G conversion (also on this forum) it looks like the setup directly onto the transferbox should work, either in high or low (or both). We need to do tests to see how much the current drain would be in both cases.
Note: I will use the motor assembly from a 2015 Leaf. Not sure if I can use the EM61 instead of the EM57 with the 2015 inverter/charger setup.
But it is easy to make the EM57 also fit to the transfercase.
(update)
I decided to go for the EM57 stack directly mounted to the main gearbox. We test fitted the stack and all seems to locate well. Regards,
Paul
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
PaulHeystee wrote: ↑Mon Apr 12, 2021 3:38 pm Hi,
Just wanted to let you know that I am also working on a EV conversion for the Fourtrack/Rocky. My aproach is using the Nissan Leaf motor and inverter.
From what I could see on the Mercedes G conversion (also on this forum) it looks like the setup directly onto the transferbox should work, either in high or low (or both). We need to do tests to see how much the current drain would be in both cases.
Note: I will use the motor assembly from a 2015 Leaf. Not sure if I can use the EM61 instead of the EM57 with the 2015 inverter/charger setup.
But it is easy to make the EM57 also fit to the transfercase.
(update)
I decided to go for the EM57 stack directly mounted to the main gearbox. We test fitted the stack and all seems to locate well.
WhatsApp Image 2021-06-19 at 23.10.09.jpeg
WhatsApp Image 2021-06-19 at 23.10.00.jpeg
Regards,
Paul
Oh hey, i've been inactive for bit and missed this, fantastic!
I'm just getting a bit more geared up to start (no pun intended), it's been a rocky year for me (also no pun intended), but i've moved home and now have a decent sized workshop to play in plus hopefully a bit of a monthly budget to put towards it.
I will admit i've been having second thoughts about the donor vehicle choice, i've recently driven a Kia Soul EV and an id3 and they're so smooth and effortless i'm a bit concerned the fourtrak is a bit of a tank and rough to drive. I'm hoping a lot of the roughness will iron out switching to electric, as i do have rather a large soft spot for this vehicle and it's practicality suits me perfectly with either/or tools and dogs in the back
-
- Posts: 89
- Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 10:26 am
- Location: Nederland
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 4 times
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
Hi Nick,
Thanks for your reaction.
We started a couple of months ago and so far we have a running vehicle, next step is to tidy everything up and do proper road testing.
After that we will convert 5 of them for a local forestry company. I am working together with a company that does Rocky rebuilds and has the biggest used parts warehouse in Europe.
I will also post some pics:
Thanks for your reaction.
We started a couple of months ago and so far we have a running vehicle, next step is to tidy everything up and do proper road testing.
After that we will convert 5 of them for a local forestry company. I am working together with a company that does Rocky rebuilds and has the biggest used parts warehouse in Europe.
I will also post some pics:
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
Now you definitely have my attentionPaulHeystee wrote: ↑Mon Aug 09, 2021 6:49 am I am working together with a company that does Rocky rebuilds and has the biggest used parts warehouse in Europe.
Look forward to more updates, we can both bring aspects of our email conversation into this thread as appropriate as we go
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
I notice you still have the rad up front, does it have a purpose in the conversion?
Also, I know you've retained the stock transmission, do you have thoughts on the hi/lo aspect? Do you think you still need it, given the motors inherent capability?
I was wondering about deleting the hi/lo gear stick and wondered even if the main gear stick could go as well obviously that leaves you with zero options for changing gear later. I definitely want the ability to engage 4wd, but i have that as a vacuum switching button on the dash, so no need for the Lo range shifter
Also, I know you've retained the stock transmission, do you have thoughts on the hi/lo aspect? Do you think you still need it, given the motors inherent capability?
I was wondering about deleting the hi/lo gear stick and wondered even if the main gear stick could go as well obviously that leaves you with zero options for changing gear later. I definitely want the ability to engage 4wd, but i have that as a vacuum switching button on the dash, so no need for the Lo range shifter
-
- Posts: 89
- Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 10:26 am
- Location: Nederland
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 4 times
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
I managed to get a max top speed of 140 km/h, which is impressive for a 'brick'
It used a lot of power, from my rough calculations it used 260 w/km at 90 km/h and approx 850 w/km at 140 km/h. Not much range with a 24 kWh battery at 81%.
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
So that's ~416wH/mile, actually about what I had guessed at, good to know thank you.
Any thoughts on my question about the transmission above?
I'm currently having second thoughts, I just got my first ev, a Zoe, I'm really loving the ride comfort and have started converting it to a 'van' for dogs and tools. Now thinking, do I really need to convert the Fourtrak? The coolness factor is high, but it's a lot of money to throw into coolness
Any thoughts on my question about the transmission above?
I'm currently having second thoughts, I just got my first ev, a Zoe, I'm really loving the ride comfort and have started converting it to a 'van' for dogs and tools. Now thinking, do I really need to convert the Fourtrak? The coolness factor is high, but it's a lot of money to throw into coolness
-
- Posts: 89
- Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 10:26 am
- Location: Nederland
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 4 times
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
Originally I wanted to connect the EM57 directly o the transferbox, however, I decided to connect it to the main gearbox, in this way I will be able to choose the right gear ratio for what I am going to do with it.
Motorway driving in 3rd, local and trailer pulling in 2nd, off road in any gear required. In a couple of weeks I will go to an off-road event and give it a try off-road. See how fast my battery discharges
Motorway driving in 3rd, local and trailer pulling in 2nd, off road in any gear required. In a couple of weeks I will go to an off-road event and give it a try off-road. See how fast my battery discharges
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm
-
- Posts: 89
- Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 10:26 am
- Location: Nederland
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 4 times
Re: Daihatsu Fourtrak
We did an off-road day at an 4DW event here in NL. It was great, and in a way boring The Rocky performed outstanding and driving was super easy, just one gear and off we drove. Lost of torque and power, really amazing.
https://youtube.com/shorts/TTlhEbgFgH0?feature=share
here is a short video.
https://youtube.com/shorts/TTlhEbgFgH0?feature=share
here is a short video.
-
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:44 pm