Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Introduction and miscellaneous that we haven't created categories for, yet
Post Reply
User avatar
Cookie6000
Posts: 246
Joined: Wed May 08, 2019 9:27 am
Location: Wicklow, IRL
Has thanked: 12 times
Been thanked: 32 times
Contact:

Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Post by Cookie6000 »

Hi all

Was going to mirror the conversation Boxster EV started for the UK except for the process and steps taken in the Republic of Ireland, what I have dealt with so far and to fine-tune the detail in the Legalities wiki.

Here is the detail from the Wiki:
  • Inspection by Automotive Engineer who reviews the placement of key components, integrity of structural components (motor mounts, battery boxes, etc), and weight distribution (use corner scales!). They are primarily interested in answering the question whether the vehicle is safe to put on the road. If the Engineer is unhappy they will request modifications and another inspection is required to verify action has been taken. Once the Engineer is happy they will write a report.
  • Written report by Automotive Engineer is delivered in ~7 days.
  • The Automotive Engineers report is sent to the Revenue together with form ?? requesting change of taxation class to electric drive.
  • Change of taxation class to electric is delivered in ~7 days.
  • Tax vehicle (currently €120).
  • Test vehicle (NCT).
  • Insure Vehicle
From the last couple of months conversion of the Audi to electric, the first two points were achieved with success. I had an approved automotive engineer assessor come and view the vehicle once I had the engine, petrol tank and all other ICE related items removed, had the Leaf motor in place hooked up to the gearbox on its new mounts. From here, it was clear to show the engineer the future plans and was great to get feedback on what could or couldn't be done before going too far.

The engineers second and final visit was when I had the car pretty much 95% complete. After an hour looking it over, he was happy the work was of satisfactory level and deemed it 'roadworthy'. Once I paid the final inspection fee, I had both his own stamped inspection report plus a 2nd RSA (Road Safety Authority) document, sometimes asked for by the NCT (National Car Test) to back up the work, by the end of the day.

With this done, it was time to get legal! First port of call is insurance as in order for you to tax your car, you need to have an insurance policy number. This is where I find the Wiki differs where it says insuring is the last thing. As the Audi was over 25 years old, I was able to avail of classic car insurance. For third party only the limitations are, no more than 5k miles, can be driven here and there, to shows, to the shops but not for work or to and from the work place. All this, depending on your past history, should work out around €155 for the year. I am unsure as to the insurance situation if your car does not classify as a classic as I had another quote of €1700 for the year from one broker. I think this is something that could be overcome by forming an Irish based EV Conversion club to avail of an affordable premium for more modern EV conversions.

Tax was the next on the list. This so far I have yet to succeed in getting as point 3 is a little vague. I have the engineers report but I am unsure as to what this 'form' is. There is the RF111 Change of Particulars form available from the motor tax website or office but, this has no reference to change of drive train, only change of colour or body type. I called the motor tax office and was met with, we have never heard of anyone ever in the history of the free state ever doing this... we cannot help you... why are you trying to do the state out of motor tax revenue... In fairness, they were very helpful, as much as they could and were willing to find a solution. So, for this step, we just need clarification on what this form is to send back to the Revenue with the engineer's report.

Once I have the car reclassified as an EV, the sooner then I can roll it down to the NCT for its overall roadworthy check, then we are away.

Hope this gives a bit of insight into my route so far for the technical sign off and reclassification of a vehicle. If we could find out the Revenue form required, it would be the final piece of the puzzle to update the Legalities Wiki and get me on the road.
Home of the #Audi8e - https://twitter.com/FiachraCooke
User avatar
Jack Bauer
Posts: 3563
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:24 pm
Location: Ireland
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 87 times
Contact:

Re: Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Post by Jack Bauer »

The form you want is RF111 :
https://www.motortax.ie/OMT/pdf/RF111_en.pdf
Section 5 Change of Engine.
You'll need your engineer to complete and stamp this section.
I'm going to need a hacksaw
User avatar
Cookie6000
Posts: 246
Joined: Wed May 08, 2019 9:27 am
Location: Wicklow, IRL
Has thanked: 12 times
Been thanked: 32 times
Contact:

Re: Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Post by Cookie6000 »

Jack Bauer wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 7:00 am The form you want is RF111 :
https://www.motortax.ie/OMT/pdf/RF111_en.pdf
Section 5 Change of Engine.
You'll need your engineer to complete and stamp this section.
Ok. Thanks. What section of Revenue do you send it to then if not the motor tax office so to avoid this main dealer nonsense.
Home of the #Audi8e - https://twitter.com/FiachraCooke
User avatar
Jack Bauer
Posts: 3563
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:24 pm
Location: Ireland
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 87 times
Contact:

Re: Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Post by Jack Bauer »

The form should be returned to your local motor tax office. Also include a copy of your engineers report.
Use registered post.
I'm going to need a hacksaw
User avatar
Cookie6000
Posts: 246
Joined: Wed May 08, 2019 9:27 am
Location: Wicklow, IRL
Has thanked: 12 times
Been thanked: 32 times
Contact:

Re: Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Post by Cookie6000 »

Ok. That's where we are running into the problem. Wicklow are not accepting the stamped eng report. They will only accept a signed and stamped report off a main dealer, Audi in my case. I can't see that happening.

Wicklow motor tax rang me yesterday and they advised the reason for the main dealer sign off was brought about due to unscrupulous garages years back where engines were being reclassed as 2.0l from 3.0l in a case that went to to the high court. As a result, there was a lot of heat on any engine conversions as the revenue dont like to see lost cash when cars are having their tax reduced. She will be the one doing the re classification and wants to help as much as she can and wants to know how other cars I know of were reclassed as elec elsewhere. I didn't go into any specifics on the evbmw conversions but they wanted to know how so they can do the same as that carried out in other counties so they are not reinventing the wheel.
Home of the #Audi8e - https://twitter.com/FiachraCooke
User avatar
Cookie6000
Posts: 246
Joined: Wed May 08, 2019 9:27 am
Location: Wicklow, IRL
Has thanked: 12 times
Been thanked: 32 times
Contact:

Re: Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Post by Cookie6000 »

Here is the 'document' they are leaning on. She kept appologising about the state of it... its a mish mash of the results of the court ruling and detail from the Revenue. And yes, it has only to do with changing of engine size, it just seems they cant get their head around the ev conversion side. Can we give an example from another county for them to reference to?
WicklowChange.JPG
Home of the #Audi8e - https://twitter.com/FiachraCooke
User avatar
Jack Bauer
Posts: 3563
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:24 pm
Location: Ireland
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 87 times
Contact:

Re: Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Post by Jack Bauer »

Don't waste time with main dealers. I got the exact same back in 2015 with Wexford when I converted the E31. So , what I would do is this. Don't engage in telephone communication. Everything in writing. Write back (via registered post) asking that they explain in writing their position and why they will not accept the work of a registered motor engineer. If your car was crash damaged and being put back on the road this is exactly who would need to sign it off. Explain your position re the main dealers and ask do they have a motor engineer whose report they WOULD accept.

Its not al all unprecedented in Wicklow. I did my first conversion there. 96D48654.
https://www.independent.ie/regionals/br ... 45875.html
Print that article and include it in the letter.
Link your youtube channel in the letter.

Obviously you want to make life as easy as possible for the people involved but you also need to show you are dead serious and just not some chancer trying to get cheap tax.

Now if its still a plain no the next step is we'll get Wexford motor tax office involved.
I'm going to need a hacksaw
User avatar
Cookie6000
Posts: 246
Joined: Wed May 08, 2019 9:27 am
Location: Wicklow, IRL
Has thanked: 12 times
Been thanked: 32 times
Contact:

Re: Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Post by Cookie6000 »

Great advice Damien. Much appreciated.
I'll get it all in the post today and report back. I hope we can set things straight for the future with at least two counties.
Home of the #Audi8e - https://twitter.com/FiachraCooke
User avatar
Jack Bauer
Posts: 3563
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:24 pm
Location: Ireland
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 87 times
Contact:

Re: Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Post by Jack Bauer »

No worries and feel free to reach out to me offline if they are still playing hardball. I know the post is slow and laborious but it is vital to have a chain of communication if this needs to go further. It's also a demonstration of your seriousness.
I'm going to need a hacksaw
User avatar
Cookie6000
Posts: 246
Joined: Wed May 08, 2019 9:27 am
Location: Wicklow, IRL
Has thanked: 12 times
Been thanked: 32 times
Contact:

Re: Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Post by Cookie6000 »

Ok, good day today. After the local motor tax office in Wicklow holding onto the paperwork for almost a month, I got the call today from them to say they finally got around to paying a bit of attention to my file and they gave it the thumbs up. Rubber stamped. The Audi 8e is now an EV :D
The last piece of detail they needed was just the serial number from the Leaf motor and that was it.

So, here are the steps to a successful end to end process to get your conversion legal and on the road in Ireland.
  • Get in touch with a local accredited Automotive Engineer and have them look at your build when you are at a point before you are ready to go cut and weld parts to the chassis. This will enable him/her to discuss and review the placement of key components, integrity of structural components (motor mounts, battery boxes, etc), and weight distribution. Ideally, try and get the use of corner scales before and after the build.
  • The engineer will primarily be interested in answering the question of whether the vehicle is safe to put on the road. If the Engineer is unhappy with any aspects of the build, they will request modifications and another inspection will be required to verify action has been taken.
  • If the advice is followed however and the Engineer is happy on the second visit at completion, they will complete a final engineers report signing off the build. Request they complete Section 5 of the RF111 Change of Particulars form complete with date of motor change, motor serial number and finally, signed and stamped by the accredited engineer - pic below
  • Worth asking for an RSA Modifications Report also for when the time comes for the NCT
  • Written report by Automotive Engineer is received in ~7 days.
  • Documents to send to your local motor tax office
    • Automotive Engineers report - signed and stamped
    • Completed RF111 Change of Particulars form - Section 5 - signed and stamped
    • Vehicle Registration Certificate (VRC)
    • Cover letter outlining you and your project, the how, why, where, etc.
  • Change of taxation class to electric is delivered, usually in around 7 days.
  • Tax vehicle (currently €120)
  • Insure Vehicle - This was actually possible once you had the completed engineer's report
  • Test vehicle (NCT) - Bring all documentation submitted to local motor tax office as well as the RSA Modifications Report
  • Drive off into the electrified sunset...
A couple of notes on this process for me. Submitting to Wicklow for me took a month and you may find this in some counties where this has never come across their desks or they are leaning on stricter new rules in the last 5 years. There is a chance they will look for a main dealer stamp. This is obviously an impossibility as no main dealer is going to sign off on a non own OEM part being installed. Reach out to a main dealer of the main vehicle and simply ask them to, in writing, confirm that they will not certify non OEM parts fitted to their vehicles and that is what an independent accredited automotive engineer is for. I found the main Audi dealers to be very helpful and supplied me with a letter outlining the facts. It's all just to make it as easy as possible for the officials who see will likely never see something like this appear in the inbox and to remove any suspicion it's some sort of tax dodge :lol:

I hope this helps and if there are any changes you find yourself in the process, please add them in here, as I will as I get to the final hurdle of the NCT.

Can this be put in the Wiki now by a moderator who moderates? Thanks!
RF111 Section 5.JPG
Home of the #Audi8e - https://twitter.com/FiachraCooke
User avatar
New Electric Ireland
Posts: 172
Joined: Sun May 31, 2020 12:22 pm
Location: Ireland
Been thanked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Post by New Electric Ireland »

Congratulations Fiachra and thanks for documenting the process so that others can follow in your footsteps :)
In Ireland we undertake training & open source RND for the New Electric group, 5 companies converting boats, buses, cars and trucks to electric drive since 2008.
User avatar
Cookie6000
Posts: 246
Joined: Wed May 08, 2019 9:27 am
Location: Wicklow, IRL
Has thanked: 12 times
Been thanked: 32 times
Contact:

Re: Registering and changing tax class of an EV conversion in the Rep of Ireland

Post by Cookie6000 »

New Electric Ireland wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 10:45 am Congratulations Fiachra and thanks for documenting the process so that others can follow in your footsteps :)
Thank you. Hope things get easier across any other counties the more of us go through the process.

Edit: I have updated the Wiki
Home of the #Audi8e - https://twitter.com/FiachraCooke
Post Reply