Chademo Controller Development

[Isaac96]

Looks good to me. It also makes me wonder whether my pin assignments are correct in the v0.4 code - they're in globals.h.
IN1 and IN0 may be reversed, would you mind checking that out? For that matter OUT0 and OUT1 might be backwards too. I think I set those according to the first VCU wiring diagram you put up.

Also, how should OUT3 be integrated into the software? I'm not sure what you're planning to use it for.

-Isaac

[Jack Bauer]

So I want OUT3 to activate when hv is required and de activate when charging finishes. Yeah I've changed a few things around on this design but no need to worry about that right now. We'll just get it running on the leaf vcu then can adapt.

[Isaac96]

So I want OUT3 to activate when hv is required and de activate when charging finishes. Yeah I've changed a few things around on this design but no need to worry about that right now. We'll just get it running on the leaf vcu then can adapt.

Alright, I'll look at the code and see where that could fit. Is it intended to power up a contactor system?

-Isaac

[Jack Bauer]

Yeah its just a HV request signal if that makes sense.

[Isaac96]

CHAdeMO VCU from Damien arrived today! Thank you so much!!!

I'll have it wired up in an hour or so and go try it out (just waiting on ISA shunt, that should be here soon enough).
At least I can see how CAN works and whether I set up the I/O correctly.

HV request - that will be in the next version after I've verified correct operation.

-Isaac

[Isaac96]

CHAdeMO VCU from Damien arrived today! Thank you so much!!!

I'll have it wired up in an hour or so and go try it out (just waiting on ISA shunt, that should be here soon enough).
At least I can see how CAN works and whether I set up the I/O correctly.

HV request - that will be in the next version after I've verified correct operation.

-Isaac

So it's been a little more than an hour. I've got the VCU mostly wired up now.
But IN2 has a 1K5 pulldown (part of the voltage divider) which is being annoying (I think I have a 10K, far too weak).

I see on the schematic for the future CHAdeMO VCU that has been changed to a pullup, so I'll probably do the same on this Leaf VCU.

Pin names have been changed to reflect the hardware better, v0.5 is coming after some testing @ station with HV request added.

-Isaac

[Isaac96]

Looks like Leaf VCU communicates correctly.
Charge shuts down (after closing contactors) because I still have neither batteries nor shunt hooked up, but that should all still work.

v0.5 is attached, with HV request added.

Also edited this wiring diagram to reflect the new wiring.

Anyone else with Leaf VCU, you might want to remove R17 (1k5 pulldown on IN2) if you don't have other plans for the VCU. If not I suppose a buffer or optocoupler might work.

-Isaac

[Jack Bauer]

Fantastic. Will be able to test in the E39 in a few weeks. Thanks as always:)

[mfox]

This is great . I also want to make chademo on my BMW.
Max system voltage is 220V .
As I can see all this is adjustable

[Kevin Sharpe]

This is great . I also want to make chademo on my BMW.
Max system voltage is 220V .

Some CHAdeMO rapid chargers do not support low voltage operation (see Damien's test videos from a few years ago). We don't know how widespread this problem is so you will be on the 'bleeding edge' for sure

[Bigpie]

Zero motorcycles dropped development on chademo, chargers not fully implementing the spec was one of the reasons, https://chargedevs.com/features/zero-mo ... ity-testin

Maybe you could use the buck boost from a prius to accept the higher voltage from chademo and buck it down to your needs?

[Isaac96]

Buck charging is a possibility. Official spec requires operation down to 125v, and iirc Damien charged a 144v pack a while back? It seems to depend on the charger.

[mfox]

hopefully these newer chargers support low voltage systems. Buck is option but it is complicate. It requires space, cooling mechanisam ...
I dont like that...
But in our country tere is no fast charging before 2016.y , as I remember, I can also say before 2017

[PatrykS]

Buck charging is a possibility. Official spec requires operation down to 125v, and iirc Damien charged a 144v pack a while back? It seems to depend on the charger.

Official CHAdeMO specification mandates 50V as a minimum, and I tested charging of ~60V battery on Efacec charger.

[Jack Bauer]

If you want to discuss chademo chargers please start a new topic. This thread relates to the design and development of a vehicle side controller.

[IanG]

Hi All,

Amazing collaboration going on here. I have been lurking on this thread for the last couple of months and I would like to volunteer as a beta tester?

I have been wanting to fit CHAdeMO to my race bike (s) and have a 10kW single phase portable CHAdeMO charger ready to go. I built the battery with an ISA IVT-MOD fitted, as well as the additional contactors. I just need to mount the receptacle somewhere.

I've been thinking about the integration with BMS and other vehicle safety systems. Looking at the code (I am not a software guy but I do write pseudo code/ flow diagrams in control schemes occasionally) with the max V hard coded and the activate/deactivate appears to occur as the controller is powered up and the CHAdeMO charger is connected?

From this it looks as through the BMS needs to interrupt the 12V supply if the battery gets hot of some other issue occurs? Or have I missed some important point?

Also, on the schematic, R69 120R resistor for CAN termination, shouldn't this short between pin 6 and 7 on IC3? At the moment it just seems to siting parallel on Pin 6.

Great job and I can't wait to buy a demo board.

[Isaac96]

Hi All,

Amazing collaboration going on here. I have been lurking on this thread for the last couple of months and I would like to volunteer as a beta tester?

I have been wanting to fit CHAdeMO to my race bike (s) and have a 10kW single phase portable CHAdeMO charger ready to go. I built the battery with an ISA IVT-MOD fitted, as well as the additional contactors. I just need to mount the receptacle somewhere.

I've been thinking about the integration with BMS and other vehicle safety systems. Looking at the code (I am not a software guy but I do write pseudo code/ flow diagrams in control schemes occasionally) with the max V hard coded and the activate/deactivate appears to occur as the controller is powered up and the CHAdeMO charger is connected?

From this it looks as through the BMS needs to interrupt the 12V supply if the battery gets hot of some other issue occurs? Or have I missed some important point?

Also, on the schematic, R69 120R resistor for CAN termination, shouldn't this short between pin 6 and 7 on IC3? At the moment it just seems to siting parallel on Pin 6.

Great job and I can't wait to buy a demo board.

Awesome! Great to have more testers (I'm still waiting on an ISA shunt, it's coming all the way from Estonia).
You are correct -- so far, there's no BMS interlock at all. Once I can get more testing done I will add it over CAN or digital, but Damien wants the simplest possible code for the beta.
Max voltage can be edited via serial interface, but there are hard coded defaults too (for first startup and then in case of corruption).

-Isaac

[IanG]

OK, Cool, makes a lots of sense, getting the charger to respond reliably and consistently is going to be the biggest challenge.

I think a single I/O (Go/No Go) from the BMS is all the feedback that is necessary at this point.

[arber333]

A question if I may regarding of current sensor.
Could we use an analog 5V hall current sensor with leaf VCU? I have two LEM automotive sensors here. One from Ampera battery and the second is similar. Also I have a bunch of different 5V Tamura sensors from different projects.

It's just to cover all bases.

Tnx

A

[celeron55]

It's actually not 100% necessary to measure current to get chademo working, as it's not transmitted to the charger. Goes against the spec I guess, but still. The charger will tell you what current it's putting out.

Same applies for voltage, but that's going into "how to make your batteries explode" territory.

The ISA shunt is really handy for both current AND voltage measurement, but customization allows getting rid of extra components. Personally I get my chademo charge voltage measurement from the Leaf inverter on canbus, in addition to my bms.

[Isaac96]

OK, Cool, makes a lots of sense, getting the charger to respond reliably and consistently is going to be the biggest challenge.

I think a single I/O (Go/No Go) from the BMS is all the feedback that is necessary at this point.

Absolutely. I'll add that once basic functionality is confirmed.

A question if I may regarding of current sensor.
Could we use an analog 5V hall current sensor with leaf VCU? I have two LEM automotive sensors here. One from Ampera battery and the second is similar. Also I have a bunch of different 5V Tamura sensors from different projects.

It's just to cover all bases.

Tnx

A

That should work, using the throttle input on Leaf VCU. However you'd need to edit the code quite a bit -- I'm considering abstracting away the I/O from the main code, to support different sensors. Might also need to add amphour counting functionality, which is another layer of annoyance.
Also not sure how good the resolution will be.

-Isaac

[Isaac96]

It's actually not 100% necessary to measure current to get chademo working, as it's not transmitted to the charger. Goes against the spec I guess, but still. The charger will tell you what current it's putting out.

Same applies for voltage, but that's going into "how to make your batteries explode" territory.

The ISA shunt is really handy for both current AND voltage measurement, but customization allows getting rid of extra components. Personally I get my chademo charge voltage measurement from the Leaf inverter on canbus, in addition to my bms.

Totally - the car handles all the mismatch measurements (happened to me with a shunt, off by a factor of 4). Mismatch detection is only there for liability reasons.

[arber333]

That should work, using the throttle input on Leaf VCU. However you'd need to edit the code quite a bit -- I'm considering abstracting away the I/O from the main code, to support different sensors. Might also need to add amphour counting functionality, which is another layer of annoyance.
Also not sure how good the resolution will be.

-Isaac

Ok great!
Usually different sensos use different mV/A maybe that should be one variable that we will have to set.
So i propose to add three variables. We do have a settings interface dont we?
1. is it a CAN msg sensor or analog 5V?
2. if analog, what is the mV/A ratio?
3. What is the sensor 0A reading? Some centers may read 0A at 2.5V some at 2V or some at 3V...

Resolution should be to tenth of A. With Chademo charging at 50A mistake of 1A means very little voltage rise on battery. What is the resolution on chademo station side?
I think we should use up to 200A sensors anyway.

[Isaac96]

Ok great!
Usually different sensos use different mV/A maybe that should be one variable that we will have to set.
So i propose to add three variables. We do have a settings interface dont we?
1. is it a CAN msg sensor or analog 5V?
2. if analog, what is the mV/A ratio?
3. What is the sensor 0A reading? Some centers may read 0A at 2.5V some at 2V or some at 3V...

Resolution should be to tenth of A. With Chademo charging at 50A mistake of 1A means very little voltage rise on battery. What is the resolution on chademo station side?
I think we should use up to 200A sensors anyway.

CHAdeMO current readings are accurate to 1A, so no more than that is needed. 200A is a good limit for CHAdeMO only, though of course more is needed if one wishes to use the sensor for general instrumentation.
Resolution should be good with a +-200A range over 12 bits - that should be accurate to about 0.1A.

However, I'd like to hold off on the additional sensors until the original setup works -- glad to add more functionality at that point, but adding more to the code is a recipe for confusion when debugging.

-Isaac

[arber333]

CHAdeMO current readings are accurate to 1A, so no more than that is needed. 200A is a good limit for CHAdeMO only, though of course more is needed if one wishes to use the sensor for general instrumentation.
Resolution should be good with a +-200A range over 12 bits - that should be accurate to about 0.1A.

However, I'd like to hold off on the additional sensors until the original setup works -- glad to add more functionality at that point, but adding more to the code is a recipe for confusion when debugging.

-Isaac

Yes with my EVdisplay i use 1000A sensor, but its reporting is internal. Chip can send pwm signal to the SOC dial or serial report out of the Bluetooth port. Other than that i will have to use another sensor for Chademo anyway.
But if station is content with only CAN reports and since i already use simpBMS i dont see a problem if i could use SimpBMS CAN report for amps and SOC as well as some sort of fault signal?