[DRIVING] Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter  [FINISHED]

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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

Damn! I will just let slip the dogs of mechanical engineering... Some engineer i am :( .
My negligence caught up with me. If you remember from the motor mounting post i made a rather flimsy rear mount and convinced myself that torque will only pass through it in one direction. Well DOH! Torque passes through it from two sides...sometimes more than one reversals in a second! This really stressed the 12mm bolt which was fixed only from one side. And last weekend it broke just as i was trying to setup the motor parameters.
Of course motor was jumping at less than ideal settings and caused additional stress in the single mounting point. This sheared the bolt clean off.

I went back to the drawing board and this time i decided to make a propper fork mount with a box fixture. I welded the box on my first try and it seemed it would work.
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But i noticed the rear edge of the box leans over to the HPAS body! That is unacceptable and prone to damage. So i decided to cut the box from the plate and reweld it at an angle, so that rear box part would clear the HPAS body behind the motor. There will be a lot of welding involved!!!
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

Well i have done some more driving and i noticed a disturbing thing. When inverter started PWM at car driveoff and sometimes when it stopped my speedo went crays and turned almost to full speed 240kh/h. It was really annoying, but nothing more, untill i noticed the speedo really governs the odometer. I thought this was counted by signal from ABS sensors! Lazy engineers went the easy route obviously :).

Now if i dont want to have the signal raising my Km driven i will have to shield the cables that go to my junction box. No problem, i have 4 core LiYCY shielded cable and i really need only 3 cores from axle sensor to the box. Then there is a 4 core from the box towards speedo dial. I am not sure where the pulses come in. I will probably need to take everything apart :oops:

Here is a strange thing though. RPM indicator surprisingly does not bounce even with the fact it takes and process the same signal as speedo. So i could assume arduino signal is good and errors show on the original wires after arduino interface.
Maybe i should just build a low pass filter for blanking signals over 200Hz.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

Finally i made enough of the BMS boards that i can comfortably go and slaughter those Jaguar modules.
IMG_20210103_195528.jpg
I cut them down to 2P blocks for 120Ah.
First i remove the plastic cover and BMS connection. Then i mark cuts that will make the 2P blocks. Some of them can be used 2P2S since they were
meant to connect to the other side of the module.
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I then separated individual cells and drilled 5mm holes in their tabs. I connected cells in groups of 2P8S with a tab for + and - side.
IMG_20210109_162609.jpg
Today I have made enough cells to fit into the front box. Hurrah! And when i calculated their number i got 10 groupd of 8 cells which i will use in modules of 16 cells as BMS supports that. And behold, all 80 cells will fit the front box! I guess rear box will holt only 2P16S + 2P8S which is 86Vdc
IMG_20210109_204235.jpg
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

I made more of the BMS cables for my Minifit connectors. I think they are great. Very compact and firm attachment to the board.
I crimped terminals and inserted the wires by their numbers so that there would be no doubt on how to assemble them on the battery side.
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After some more work on the battery packs i was looking at how to assemble and connect them in my pack. Orientation of the packs is vital to ease of assembly. I learned with Mazda that i need to put modules together so that assembly/disassembly is safe even using metal tools.
I was sitting in front of the battery thinking how to do that in constrained space of the battery box, when it dawned on me! Battery terminals are oriented to bolt cables from the top. If i would make them accept copper rails from the sides, i could make the connections more managable... straight rails. Also since i will be stacking two modules one over the other i need to pay attention to clearance between two modules. But terminal is just under the top/bottom of the modules leaving no space for the head of the connecting bolt. Just using the bolt on existing terminals would create possibility bolt heat would touch something conductive on the other pack and ... BANG!

But end terminals are welded to battery tabs. And any twisting could tear them off and destroy that module! And taking 2P8S modules apart is out of the question since i already taped the modules up and made all packages nice and tight.
Question is how to bend 1mm thick end terminal by 90deg in a specific spot? Answer lies in a correct use of torque and support.
To achieve that i made a bending tool. It is made from 4mm copper contact, steel could do, but it is more difficult to form.
IMG_20210117_201218_HHT.jpg
I bent it at right angle and cut one end to size, so it will support the force of my torque directly on the spot where contact needs to bend. The other side i bent up and taped it up so it wouldnt hurt my hand.
IMG_20210117_202804_HHT.jpg
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I also drilled a hole for the M6 bolt and after some thought i decided to solder a nut underneath it. This allows me to assemble the whole thing without having to look everywhere when that nut rolls away :).
IMG_20210117_205904.jpg
With this tool bolted to the terminal i pushed into the terminal to keep it in position and pushed down on one end. Terminal twisted exactly on the spot i desired and the form of the tool allowed me to remove it sideways from the bend. Voila!
I now have all my end terminals bent so they accept rails from the side.
IMG_20210117_201115_HHT.jpg
IMG_20210117_201109_HHT.jpg
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

This weekend i went through the RLS RMF44U, commutation encoder manual here: https://www.rls.si/eng/fileuploader/dow ... utions.pdf

Because i just couldnt capture encoder 0° I decided i need to take apart the encoder and inspect magnet mounting and rest of assembly. Because i needed to do lots of steps quickly and by myself i wasnt able to take pictures.

What i found out...
1. I found my encoder mount had only 2 bolts fixing it to the motor case. What an error! It seems i was in a hurry and put only 2 bolts in to test the assembly and then forgot to close everything for sure.
2. I found that my magnet mount was rubbing on the encoder mount/plate on the inside. Probably because of the incorrect fitting.

I also discovered when i tightened the fittings that magnet mount protrudes just a tiny bit over encoder fitting. I couldnt torqued it more because it came to its stop on the motor shaft, So i took it off and put it in my lathe and shaved about 1mm off of the rear side. I deburred edges and tried to install it. I could set it in ok with a little play.
Sergio Fabris from RLS explained to me that magnet itself is not susceptible to high temperature and can withstand some 600°C before it looses its magnetic properties. But he also explained the optimal gap under the encoder plate is 0.5mm to 1mm. If encoder is too close or too far it would not capture correct sensor position.

Then i went on to calibrate hall sensors and i got good 0° capture with some 3° of deviation. I will need to work on that still.
But now i get really good driveoff in reverse. But i still got quite some jolt in the forward direction. That got me thinking my motor mount is to be blamed... It has large holes in its rubber to alleviate vibrations from diesel engine. Electric motor does not oscillate, but rather moves through the whole amplitude. This might move the sealant block center to its edge where it hit the metal edge... bang! Also that move is detrimental to motor position readback.
I took the mount down and filled the holes with some Sika window sealant that is elastic after drying and can withstand a lot of force. After drying off i put the mount back in the car and went for a test run.
That trembling just before stop is gone now. All I had to do is recalibrate sensors.
Vibration has lessened substantially but that mount rubber is still too soft for my liking. I think i will order replacement sealant block and push it in the mount later.

Also i had another problem. All the banging and motor jumping has caused my motor mount to break. It split on the weld seam and was causing terrible noise in my engine bay. I guess 3mm box and my welding skills were not enough to prevent that.
I took one 5mm metal plate and cut myself L shape out of it plus a triangular brace. It even looks better and more compact now. I welded old fork and new mount together and paint it with Zinc spray.
I finally gave it a coat of black paint and then put it in the car. Now there is no more banging and motor feels really firm.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by johu »

This sounds familiar, you might remember: viewtopic.php?p=2142#p2142
My motor mounts are also too flexible and the whole drive train swings a lot. The left motor mount is not even solidly connected to the rubber, it just inserted into a rubber hole.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

johu wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 1:17 pm This sounds familiar, you might remember: viewtopic.php?p=2142#p2142
My motor mounts are also too flexible and the whole drive train swings a lot. The left motor mount is not even solidly connected to the rubber, it just inserted into a rubber hole.
True! Remember our conversation about Openinverter vs Lebowski shaking on start? Well i just brought that to minimum.
I recommend you revisit your motor mounts because they actually contribute a lot to general resolver control stiffeness. Now that my 3rd rubber mount is allowed to only move a little under torque the counter shakes at driveoff from standstill die off really quick. I really need to replace that rubber shock block with one made from full rubber.
Any electric motor only needs rubber mounts so it doesnt transfer noise to the frame. It does not need mounts to dampen any amplitude vibrations. If you install some you will get undesired movement in your resolver control which you will have to dampen with software. It all creates undesirable delay in FOC feedback and means motor feels less springy.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by SKB123 »

Hi and well done, I'm also working out a Peugeot project

I'm planning my motor and drive shaft attachments at the min, do you mind sharing photos of how you have dealt with the driveshaft behind the motor please.
Thinking of adding an angled plate to the motor gearbox plate - looking for your best advice
Should know better - Learning, one f@#$ up at a time :D
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

SKB123 wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 11:43 pm Hi and well done, I'm also working out a Peugeot project

I'm planning my motor and drive shaft attachments at the min, do you mind sharing photos of how you have dealt with the driveshaft behind the motor please.
Thinking of adding an angled plate to the motor gearbox plate - looking for your best advice
Hi, thanks.

This is my 3rd iteration and considering i am ME i have not done a good job untill now :).

For my EM61 Leaf motor i have made a 5mm back plate to bolt on to the back of the motor and i welded my mount iterations to it.
For connection to the chassis i used mounting block from Renault Traffic diesel car mostly because it was available and it was also oriented correctly for my purpose. Most work was with the "fork box" where the rubber mount meets the motor. In the latest iteration i took the old "fork box" which is evidently satisfactory and welded it to a new L shaped 5mm sheet metal profile. I had to make a hole where the bolt meets the fork nut and that required some tack welding and trying out at first. Then i verified all clearances and movement arcs of the mount under torque.

Here is the link to my blog where i post pictures of my build. https://leafdriveblog.wordpress.com/tag/mounts/
There are tags to choose from on the right side that lead you to various items. I welcome you look through there if you can find some helpfull info.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

Today i made some needed work to remove the small battery and use the "normal" 55Ah size one under the trunk. That cleaned right side in the trunk and left more space for parking sensors unit.
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I installed the parking sensors to add some safety since i noticed i can lean onto the rear battery box when i park into a higher curb.
Some day i may also install rear camera for parking assist.
IMG_20210410_211246.jpg
I also installed 2x DS18S20 digital temp sensors in the front battery box. I taped them onto the top battery stack near the contacts. I may move them if i find that is not a good place. I also setup power reduction if my battery would go above 45degC. Ramp is set to 50Arms/degC reduction after 45degC.
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Those sensors work on single wire bus. Every sensor has unique digital code that Lebowski brain recognizes and they read 19.3deg C in my garage. Since this system can work with like 8 sensors on the same bus i would recommend Johannes to code those in Openinverter as an option for motor/controler/battery sensors. https://pdfserv.maximintegrated.com/en/ds/DS18S20.pdf
I see some code here: https://gist.github.com/bassdread/6050f ... 4d7c995783

Also i would like to point out i got some very similar sensors from ebay. When i connected them i got huge values. It seems genuine DS18S20 sensors are 9bit and shady ebay sensors are 12bit. But they carry the same name... :shock:. I could use them and set every value x8... but why bother. Genuine sensors work very nicely.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

For couple of months now i have been writing down my charging values.
There are two scenarios for my daily driving and most of the values varied very little.
a. When i drove my wife to work i made 52km with 9.4kWh recharged consistently in summer.
b. If i drove alone directly to work i made 40km with 7.2kW recharged.
Values are mostly 110km/h - 130km/h highway driving with mixed city driving in the end.

Point a) shows consumption of 18.1kWh per 100km driven
Point b) also shows 18kWh per 100km.

Thats it then :).
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by johu »

That is very respectable at that speed!
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

All things vary and my Webasto fuel heater is no different. Last week it bought the farm :) and the winter is really comming!
So i needed a replacement fast. Option would be to cannibalize the second one from Mazda, but that one neeeds servicing too as i noticed.
So another serious option was to remove Webasto and install Outlander electric heater.
21901987ad92f3d483d6d3132a802565-mitsubishi-outlander-sildytuvas-ausinimo-skyscio.png
I thought on how to deair the system and i made (soldered) a simple valve from copper pipe and valve which was made just for that purpose. I put that to the highest point in the system.

First i needed to decide on how to connect it to HV. I just love those solar connectors. They are sealed and polarized. If you decide on a convention which connector is + and - you never need to worry when to dissassemble it.
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I connected directly to inverters second connector which originally connectede to heater and AC compressor anyway.

Webasto was removed and i used its mounting plate to now mount electric heater. Some bent hoses and a CAN harness later i had a working HV heater. It only needs to see correct CAN telegram to start. I set my DUE up to show telegram only at start without correct values. Those values are added when i ground a certain pin on DUE.
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In addition i implemented temp loop with CAN reporting. DUE is looking at a certain byte and regulating heaeter power accordingly. I decided i dont need to go over 55deg outlet temperature and 50deg for the full power of the heater. This saves some energy.

After some thought i prepared a cruise control switch to a new task. After i cut the wires i spliced my new wires in and tried not to touch the signaling light. So i allways see if heater is on.
Since the switch is signal high 12V it is too much for my poor DUE and i had to add a relay to invert the signal to GND. On DUE i use weak pullup and this relay pulls it down to GND.
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After a week of slow use finally temp got to -2deg and heater had to go to work.
I needed about 12kWh now!!! Quite a change in range from 9.4kWh in summer.
SOC shows 33% draw at -2deg!
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

I have 3x Eltek chargers wired 3phase in star circuit with common neutral. Each can pull 3kW from its phase. Now in my house i have various loads distributed between phases. To avoid overloading my system i decided to make a loop in my DUE code that will allow me to toggle between chargers with a single button. This will only take one input pin and toggle between 3 CAN addresses in any combination.

CheckButton function is used with flags

Code: Select all

charger%20flags
bool Charger1 = false; //flag for charger1
bool Charger2 = false; //flag for charger2
bool Charger3 = false; //flag for charger3
Then i call function

Code: Select all

checkButton();
Now function i declare with all options and debouncing

Code: Select all

void checkButton()
{
  buttonState = digitalRead(button);
  if (lastButtonState != buttonState)
  {
    lastButtonState = buttonState;
    //has the button been released (HIGH is not pushed)
    if (buttonState == HIGH)
    {
      buttonCounter++;
      if (buttonCounter == 1) {
        Charger1 = true;        
        Charger2 = false;
        Charger3 = false;    
      }

      else if (buttonCounter == 2) {
        Charger1 = false;        
        Charger2 = true;
        Charger3 = false;      
      }
      else if (buttonCounter == 3) {
        Charger1 = false;        
        Charger2 = false;
        Charger3 = true;
      }
      else if (buttonCounter == 4) {
        Charger1 = true;        
        Charger2 = true;
        Charger3 = false;
      }
      else if (buttonCounter == 5) {
        Charger1 = false;        
        Charger2 = true;
        Charger3 = true;
      }
      else if (buttonCounter == 6) 
      {
        Charger1 = true;        
        Charger2 = false;
        Charger3 = true;
      }    
      else
{
        buttonCounter = 0;         
        Charger1 = true;        
        Charger2 = true;
        Charger3 = true;     
      } 
    }   
  }
}
Now i can see all combinations and toggle code for CAN bus telegram

Code: Select all

digitalWrite(PP_relay,HIGH); // turn on Cp_relay  
  if(millis()-lastime > myVars.transmitime)  //Nominally set for 120ms - do stuff on 120 ms non-interrupt clock
    {
     if(Charger1 == true){
     lastime=millis();        
      sendCANframeA();  
      printstatus();
digitalWrite(LED1_pin, HIGH);
         } 
         else {
digitalWrite(LED1_pin, LOW);
 }      
     if(Charger2 == true){
     lastime=millis();        
      sendCANframeB();
      printstatus();
digitalWrite(LED2_pin, HIGH);       
    }
         else {
digitalWrite(LED2_pin, LOW);
 }  
     if(Charger3 == true){
     lastime=millis();        
      sendCANframeC();
      printstatus();
digitalWrite(LED3_pin, HIGH);       
}
         else {
digitalWrite(LED3_pin, LOW);
 }         
}      
}             
else {
digitalWrite(PP_relay,LOW); // turn off PP_relay
 }
I also added three LEDs to signify each charger channel and provide visual UI.
I coded them to transistor pins of the ULN2003 chip so DUE provides pulldown and 12V is connected to each LED.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

AC is now properly tested!
Code for control could be found here:
viewtopic.php?p=35830#p35830
I will work on variable power output depending on outside temperature too.

In the heat of the midday i drove from work and turned on the AC. Cold air started to blow immediately and AC signal will operate via internal clutch relay. I think i will have to add more power still, but system functions on a single feedback loop from its own CAN report.
This by itself lends to simple use, however it carries negative aspects too. Whenever AC is switched off via this large relay 12V is disrupted enough for my Arduino DUE control circuit to drop its eggs. Seriously DUE will drop and this will pull notaus signal low, in effect disabling the car for a split second. Enough for inverter to notice and raise error flag. This is specially annoying at speed on the highway. Luckily it is not dangerous, because Lebowski control has excellent feedback and will immediately revert to run mode. The jolt i feel is scary though.

Plan is to isolate that specific signal and introduce a suppression diode on this line. Also i will draw a separate 12V supply line specificaly for DUE isolated from the rest of the car switching system... Maybe i will add some decoupling caps too...
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

Today is a national holliday and i took some time to service my Pug.
AC clutch relay is making noise on VCU supply line. There is this 12V supply line that goes from BSI to the rear of the car from where i took 12V to supply my DUE and relay logic.
To solve the issue I took one wire from my latching relay. This will provide 12V when inverter is ON. I routed it through the firewall to my 12V connection under center console. I reconnected my DUE and from the short drive i took to test it seems AC clutch relay doesnt disturb DUE anymore.
I still hear the AC relay unpleasant burst through the radio, but my new supply line is clean. 8-)

On second note i spliced cooling fan wires and fit another command wire to it. I tested that particular connection to confirm the kind of signal i need to run cooling fans at low speed. I found if i connect 12V to thin red line only right fan comes to life and at full speed! We dont want that.
Next i found if i connect 12V to thick white line this will start both fans at low speed. I imagine low speed should still be enough to cool down 3 Eltek chargers.
So i pulled wire out of connector and spliced another (orange) cable into it. After protecting connection with heatshrink tubes i pushed relays back into their place with additional orange wire going towards 30A relay. I use coolant pump signal to start this relay which will then run coolant fans at drive or at charging. I like to keep connection simple for now, but later i intend to harvest CAN signal from chargers which report temperature and i will slave that relay to DUE coolant output.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

I mounted the box to the place of exhaust. While i thinkered with idea to suspend it the same way as the exhaust, rubber blocks cause it to hang too low, not good for safety. In the end i used two M8 bolts to firmly attach the box to the rear battery box.
It is self sustained, no power from the car required. Only solid GND is required. I intend to test this a bit. In the end i will probably add CAN line to BMS for protection.
Idea is to use a heartbeat telegram similar to Outlanders 0x285 to keep chademo operating. If that ID would be missing VCU would stop Chademo process.

Edit: that rust does not belong there 😁. I guess there is no such thing as inox welding wire. I have to sort it out before winter.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by crasbe »

arber333 wrote: Mon Aug 22, 2022 7:24 am Edit: that rust does not belong there 😁. I guess there is no such thing as inox welding wire. I have to sort it out before winter.
Welding stainless steel in a way that the welds won't rust is pretty difficult. You have to have good Argon gas coverage (most simple MIG welders don't have gas preflow or postflow) and the welds have to be cleaned and passivated. That's usually a really nasty acid based solution which is applied to the welds to make them as shiny as the rest of the metal.

If you have any contaminations or bad gas coverage, the welds and surrounding areas will start to rust.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

crasbe wrote: Mon Aug 22, 2022 9:31 am Welding stainless steel in a way that the welds won't rust is pretty difficult. You have to have good Argon gas coverage (most simple MIG welders don't have gas preflow or postflow) and the welds have to be cleaned and passivated. That's usually a really nasty acid based solution which is applied to the welds to make them as shiny as the rest of the metal.

If you have any contaminations or bad gas coverage, the welds and surrounding areas will start to rust.
Yes, but i didnt use any gas mix. Only flux cored wire. As i just got that welder and welds seem really good in all positions i assumed wire was inox as opposed "for welding inox" as stated on the box... got me there.
Evidence of my MIG flux welding in photo. Incidentaly i found out that flux cored wire for inox is the same one as for welding other steel alloys.
I will get on the brush and grinder then...
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by crasbe »

Flux Core certainly has it's applications, but corrosion resistant stainless steel welding certainly isn't one of them... as you learned now 😅

But given the material, with a good coat of paint after derusting it should last a long time as well.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

crasbe wrote: Mon Aug 22, 2022 11:58 am Flux Core certainly has it's applications, but corrosion resistant stainless steel welding certainly isn't one of them... as you learned now 😅

But given the material, with a good coat of paint after derusting it should last a long time as well.
True, i really like flux because i can use it outside without worrying about wind. Surface does need some grinding but still less than MIG weld starved of CO2.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by m.art.y »

arber333 wrote: Mon Aug 22, 2022 7:24 am It is self sustained, no power from the car required. Only solid GND is required. I intend to test this a bit. In the end i will probably add CAN line to BMS for protection.
Hi, how did you make it self sustained where are you taking the power from?
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by arber333 »

m.art.y wrote: Tue Aug 23, 2022 6:35 am Hi, how did you make it self sustained where are you taking the power from?
I use 12V LED 3A power supply. Just to be sure i replaced 400Vdc 35uF main input cap with 450Vdc 25uFcap.
I connected PSU directly to the battery HV connection within the box. Its output i connected GND directly to the case. 12V i also adjusted to 13.6V.
I setup DUE Leaf VCU for chademo. I use one 12V relay to turn on VCU via connection of no. 7 pin on chademo socket. ISA shunt is also supplied from there. Then i use another small relay to pull in DC contactors.

Like i said i will probably connect the second CAN line to the BMS to have a way of stopping the charge in case a battery would go bad or temperature would rise. I really like the Mitsubishi way of doing things. A single 0x285 telegram acts as a heartbeat at 30ms and its presence is required for all HV components to function. Should the msg be missing or empty of data everything would refuse to function.
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Close call with temperature management!

Post by arber333 »

My wife and i went to Croatia to test my new Chademo system. I admit i have been testing it quite succesfully here, but i never went further than a single fast charging requirtement. This trip should show the merits of Chademo charging on a lesser battery size - yes i consider 40kW a bit smallish.
We went to Split which is about 450km from ourt home. We had some great sights, but a lot of drive and stops.
First we went along the coast and stopped at several short Lidl chargers. That went great at 120A charging = 43kW charge power.
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Temperature rose steadily up to about 45deg! First I had to remove batery box cover to cool down cells while driving and then i reduced charging to 25kW to keep cells at about 42deg. But we got there...
We drove around split for several days and there wasnt any problem. Cells were somewhat warm, but they chilled down in the evening...

Trip back turned into a nightmare though. About halfh way back one cell pair developed a high state during charge. It seemed to be riding high during charging for example at 4.12V while others were only at 3.95V. I had to stop charging there, but we had to be on our way nontheless.
While driving at 110km/h suddenly that particular cell dropped to 0V!!! It kept that state through the drive. Luckily there was a resting station with a charger there. I plugged up and charged. BMS showed cell quickly recovered.
It kept its state about 0.5V above the rest during charge and it stayed there when i stopped charging! This was no mere faulty sens connection.
Cell pair was quite hot to touch. Sensor showed 47deg, but i think it was more.
I had to remove the whole 16S2P (2 stacks) pack out to determine the faulty cell. Once i isolated it i didnt have any other option than to isolate that particular 8S2P stack and bypass it. This left me with 88S2P configuration, but we at least were able to continue our return home.

This event also showed me importance of standard configuration. While i played with various cell packs and their positions i found out i didnt use identical configuration - positive and negative electrode positions - simply because of using shorter lines. I couldnt use the same contact bus since it wasnt correct lenght. That caused me to strip a pack and reshuffle it to get to proper contact position. Kind of like an open heart surgery on the parking lot.... exactly like it!
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I will now proceed with battery cooling system and i think of making it more like temperature management. Like liquid cooling/heating and temperature sensing and 3way valve actuators...
This system now has priority over driving.
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Re: Peugeot 406 coupe Pininfarina with Leaf motor and Ampera inverter

Post by johu »

How are you measuring temperature? Nissan bolt a temp sensor right onto the terminal which has good thermal conductivity into the cell. They allow these points to heat up to 57°C.
Tesla even heat their cells to 45°C (if I remember correctly) so they can be rapid charged.
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