Kia E-niro 100/150kW motor

arber333
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Re: Kia E-niro 100/150kW motor

Post by arber333 »

johu wrote: Tue Dec 13, 2022 11:03 am Ah actually the above quote no longer hold true :) With firmware 5.24.R FW is fully working.
Really? That means RPM range into 10000rpm without adverse effects?
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Re: Kia E-niro 100/150kW motor

Post by johu »

Yes, when correctly parametrized (viewtopic.php?t=2783). I would still take it in steps, so when base speed is 4000 rpm or something allow 5000 rpm and test, then 6000,.... Testing means driving at that rpm and make sure it doesn't self-accelerate and doesn't trip out when coming off throttle but rather regen as configured.
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Re: Kia E-niro 100/150kW motor

Post by arber333 »

johu wrote: Tue Dec 13, 2022 12:15 pm Yes, when correctly parametrized (viewtopic.php?t=2783). I would still take it in steps, so when base speed is 4000 rpm or something allow 5000 rpm and test, then 6000,.... Testing means driving at that rpm and make sure it doesn't self-accelerate and doesn't trip out when coming off throttle but rather regen as configured.
OK so my setup from here viewtopic.php?p=49835#p49835 stil makes sense :).
Lets move testing there then...
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Re: Kia E-niro 100/150kW motor

Post by Pete9008 »

Not sure I would quite agree that it will be fine up to 10krpm. Hopefully it's all Ok but I'm still worried about controller latency.

The current firmware still has high latency of 180us, plus the lag due to pwm waveform and motor inductance. Compared to the 1.5ms period at 10k 180us is significant (~40degree with 4pole pairs). There is a real danger that at some speed this may be enough to cause the Iq/Id control loops to go unstable and if so they will go sudenly with no warning. The recent syncadv mod helps with this but it doesn't solve it completely.

Trying this on a test fixture is a very good idea!

The above is one of the reasons I'm going to use a F405 processor on mine and hope to get the latency down to nearer 30us.

Edit - just to put things into context I would guess that the chance of it going unstable before 10k is only around 25% but that is still enough to justify being cautious.
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Re: Kia E-niro 100/150kW motor

Post by arber333 »

Pete9008 wrote: Tue Dec 13, 2022 1:10 pm Not sure I would quite agree that it will be fine up to 10krpm. Hopefully it's all Ok but I'm still worried about controller latency.

The current firmware still has high latency of 180us, plus the lag due to pwm waveform and motor inductance. Compared to the 1.5ms period at 10k 180us is significant (~40degree with 4pole pairs).
With Lebowsk i use 3uS dedtime and i never have unintentional conkout now. Mostly it happens when i forget about the notaus button and throw a wallet at it :).
I will tgo about this testing with Lebowski controler on the dark side :). Resistance is futile!

EDIT: i almost forgot, a friend has exactly the same KIA motor which he does not use for now. I could get my hands on it and test it with my setup late in the game...
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Re: Kia E-niro 100/150kW motor

Post by giplt »

Did anyone here figure out how to read the temperature sensor on the Kia E-Niro motor? Can it be connected directly to the openinverter board?

I want to use it in an EV conversion project of a ship, see viewtopic.php?t=4070 for more details.

I am also looking for specs of the Kia motor spline that needs to be connected to a drive belt or chain. Is it some standard type? I won't use the Kia reduction/transmission but plan to realise a simple 1:3 reduction from a small wheel on the Kia motor and a bigger wheel around the propellor shaft. If I could use a standard part from some supplier that would be great. Or else I could order a decidated laser cut part. Any docs, drawings or other guidance would be greatly appreciated!
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Re: Kia E-niro 100/150kW motor

Post by giplt »

Forget about transmission, I will use a Kia transmission unit after all.

Question about the tmeperature sensor in the motor it still open. Has anyone here figured out if it is a thermistor or some more advanced device?
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Re: Kia E-niro 100/150kW motor

Post by HeadsUp »

linda.ljungdahl wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 5:33 pm Seems like a lot of these motor develop bearing failure sounds, so kia just changes the whole motor to a new and scraps the old one.
There is a Ukrainian guy on youtube who has rebuilt many of these motors and drives with new bearings.

There are some opinions that the early drives used "unbranded bearings" but they can be replaced with quality German FAG , SKF , Timken etc , The Ukrainian said there has been some drives needing new bearings from 5000 - 30,000 Km travelled , while some had 200,000 km on them and never had any problem , so it can be a bit random.

My drives are brand new in the factory boxes so i will keep a watch on it and it would be very easy work for me to upgrade the bearings if needed.

There are also videos advising to fit a magnetic oil drain plug to catch metallic contaminants from the oil as the early Hyundais had the magnet missing from the plug.

There are also Ceramic bearings available which use ceramic balls to electrically insulate the armature from the casing as it has been suspected that EMF may have also been damaging bearings.

An alternative to Ceramic bearings is to use a carbon brush to ground the shaft and protect the bearings that way.
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Re: Kia E-niro 100/150kW motor

Post by HeadsUp »

giplt wrote: Mon Sep 04, 2023 3:53 pm Forget about transmission, I will use a Kia transmission unit after all.

Question about the tmeperature sensor in the motor it still open. Has anyone here figured out if it is a thermistor or some more advanced device?
Happy to hear you are using the OEM transmission , If you used a drive belt or chain on the motor shaft it would put a high radial load on the shaft and bearing , The bearing was engineered to be axial connection with no radial load so much better to use the gearbox / transaxle.
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Re: Kia E-niro 100/150kW motor

Post by HeadsUp »

linda.ljungdahl wrote: Thu Aug 18, 2022 6:54 pm Got it running yesterday with just hooking everything up and resolver poles set to 4 ! :D
Short video of running and setup:

Next thing is doing a FOC tuning.
Well done !

I have been trying to find an aftermarket controller to use with my Kona drive unit , Does the Prius give full 150 kW of power ?

I will hopefully be using a Hyundai Iconiq 72 kWHr battery.

Are you aware of any other controller that can be programmed ?

I dont think i can use the original Kona controller in my ICE donor car because it will produce error codes due to all the missing CAN BUS inputs
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